Post by: chriskleeman on May 06, 2007, 11:03:46 PM
I'm hoping that this terrible weather that has been ravaging Kansas and the Midwest hasn't affected you!
Please post and let us know if everything is ok.
Thanx,
Chris K
Post by: gunug on May 07, 2007, 04:29:04 AM
10 have been killed in Kansas this weekend I read, 8 in Greensburg. Seems like I'm not the only one who thinks were being picked on:
QUOTE
“To have this many significant tornadoes is tremendously unusual,” said Larry Ruthi, meteorologist in Dodge City.
The Federal government has declared this a disaster area but the state is having trouble getting the Guard in to help because most of their equipment is in Iraq. The much more minor impact for us has been the Eagle Project we're working on for my younger son. We were trying to clean up a blighted area at the school that houses my office and now there is a pond in the middle of the area we had cleaned up and seeded with grass on Saturday. I've got to see if I can figure out a way to get a bunch of dirt into the pond without damaging any of the seeded area if I can help it. I was thinking of "pumping" dirt using a shop vac and a long pipe; but it's probably just a pipe dream! Oh, I didn't intend a pun!
I researched the new Enhanced Fujita scale and found this at the WIBW website:
QUOTE
Enter the Enhanced Fujita Scale.
The scale still has six levels, EF 0 through EF 5. Here is a chart of the new EF Scale and the approximate wind speeds.
RATING: Approx. Wind Speed
EF0 >85 MPH
EF1 86-110 MPH
EF2 111-135 MPH
EF3 136-165 MPH
EF4 166-200 MPH
EF5 >200 MPH
A second advantage that the Enhanced Fujita Scale has over the old F Scale is that it takes into account damage to vegetation. In the past if a tornado ripped across a cow pasture it may have only been rated a F1 because it didn't cause any damage. While if this tornado had gone through a town or city it may have caused damage and been a F3. With the EF scale a tornado should have the same rating no matter where it tracks.
The scale still has six levels, EF 0 through EF 5. Here is a chart of the new EF Scale and the approximate wind speeds.
RATING: Approx. Wind Speed
EF0 >85 MPH
EF1 86-110 MPH
EF2 111-135 MPH
EF3 136-165 MPH
EF4 166-200 MPH
EF5 >200 MPH
A second advantage that the Enhanced Fujita Scale has over the old F Scale is that it takes into account damage to vegetation. In the past if a tornado ripped across a cow pasture it may have only been rated a F1 because it didn't cause any damage. While if this tornado had gone through a town or city it may have caused damage and been a F3. With the EF scale a tornado should have the same rating no matter where it tracks.
My dad was a meteorologist and studied at the University of Oklahoma under Fujita who was there then. That original scale has been around for 50 years so it was probably due for an upgrade.
I have seen 5 tornados/funnels in my life now; none of them very closely luckily! I think the worse I ever saw was at least 10 miles away and was only a 2 on the old Fujita scale.
Post by: Gregg on May 07, 2007, 07:37:41 AM
I sure hope there aren't any folks buried in all that rubble. The news here had a story about a kitten found alive in the debris. A young girl rescued it, and said she would name it Twister.
They say they want to rebuild. It is the county seat, so they need someplace for local government to function out of.
Just such devastation! It's heartbreaking to listen to survivors talk about what they lost. At least the media here didn't show any "interviews" with people who lost loved ones. They need their privacy. So sad.
Post by: jwboyd on May 07, 2007, 08:23:03 AM
We have not heard of/from any of our friends/acquaintances in the area who were directly affected by the tornado, other than those who are assisting victims. There is a tremendous need for compassionate assistance of all kinds.
Post by: gunug on May 07, 2007, 08:39:56 AM
Post by: jwboyd on May 07, 2007, 09:07:56 AM
The tornado occurred on Wednesday, and Washburn's summer session was to begin the next Monday. Several of the buildings were severely damagved--so much so that the campus was not usable. The private home where I had rented a room in previous years was across the street north of the campus, and it was destroyed. Classes were conducted at Topeka's West High School.
Post by: gunug on May 07, 2007, 09:54:30 AM
He also didn't have much use for storm chasers; he thought it was stupid enough when meteorology students did it but really stupid when people did it for a challenge or a thrill.
Post by: Bbob on May 07, 2007, 11:53:12 AM
http://www.kansas.com/
the home page of the Wichita Eagle newspaper. Look under "More Tornado Coverage." The term "total destruction" means something when you see what happened in Greensburg. The site may require registration, but there is no charge.
I'm in the lower right corner of Kansas and, fortunately, we haven't had really bad weather--just heavy rains thus far.
Post by: chriskleeman on May 07, 2007, 12:50:12 PM
Chris K
Post by: dboh on May 07, 2007, 02:48:53 PM
QUOTE(gunug @ May 7 2007, 10:54 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
He also didn't have much use for storm chasers; he thought it was stupid enough when meteorology students did it but really stupid when people did it for a challenge or a thrill.
They ran a video on the news this weekend of stormchasers chasing a tornado in Oklahoma. At one point, it turned and headed directly towards them! They slammed into reverse and narrowly avoided being hit.
There was an even scarier video some 15-20 years ago. I think it was in Kansas or Missouri. Some people took cover under a highway overpass. The tornado came right at them and passed overhead, jumping onto the highway just above them. The people were holding onto cement columns and were practicly hanging on sideways. The noise was horrendous. (I still can't believe someone had the presence of mind to hold the video camera steady.) It literallly gave me nightmares.
They ought to make meterology students watch stuff like this before they go out chasing storms.
Post by: gunug on May 07, 2007, 02:59:51 PM
QUOTE
There was an even scarier video some 15-20 years ago. I think it was in Kansas or Missouri. Some people took cover under a highway overpass.
Yep, I think the one you're talking about might have been the 1991 Andover Tornado and this "might" be the video you were talking about:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=vx-Eos-DKeM&...ted&search=
I can't be sure because Youtube is blocked here at work so I can't see it right now!
Post by: dboh on May 07, 2007, 06:04:01 PM
Post by: gunug on May 07, 2007, 06:33:19 PM
http://youtube.com/watch?v=9JadCAxtrO0
Here's some of the 1966 Topeka Tornado:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LBKujdiObos&NR=1
Post by: dboh on May 07, 2007, 06:53:10 PM
I was certainly wrong about the gully, but I definitely remember those voices. I don't know how people survive something like that.
Post by: Gregg on May 07, 2007, 08:06:31 PM
That Kansas monster was put in perspective by our local weatherman. The thing was 1.7 mi. wide* where it touched down (not at the top) and stayed on the ground for 22 miles. That would have wiped out downtown Milwaukee, and travelled to Racine! (*At Wisconsin Avenue; from the lake to Marquette - for those who know Milwaukee.)
Post by: Shades of Gray on May 07, 2007, 08:13:36 PM
Apparently one of the worst ever in the region was in 1957 or 58. That tornado was several miles wide (some initially thought separate tornadoes).
The closest I came to being in a tornado was in the panhandle of Nebraska, when a funnel hit one town, skipped a town, and then was directly overhead our town, but didn't touchdown. We were in the basement with a mattress over our heads!
I did survive a typhoon in the South China Sea in 1976, no fun there either.
Post by: dolphin on May 07, 2007, 09:28:16 PM
QUOTE
Glad to hear that you Kansas folks are ok. Pretty scary stuff. I grew up in Ohio close to a town called Xenia that suffered a devastating F4 or F5 years ago... leveled the entire west 1/2 of town.
Chris K
Chris K
News/meteoroligist always talk about the Xenia tornado anytime tornadoes are sighted in Ohio.
I was stationed in Wichita, KS at McConnell AFB back in the late 60s. I remember the announcements on the radio and tv all the time. They said if you were in your vehicle and saw a funnel cloud to pull to the side of the road and get out, lie face down in a ditch/depression and cover your head with your hands/arms. Fortunately I never had to do this.
Post by: gunug on May 07, 2007, 09:31:44 PM
Post by: Frances144 on May 08, 2007, 01:36:01 AM
Where I live, in Shetland, we experience on a fairly regular basis (about twice a year, or so) winds of over 100mph for a day/night, usually during the equinox.
There is, of course, some damage on the island and you can drive about afterwards and everyone takes it in their stride. The odd roof gets blown off and an unstable building structure might take a fall, but that is about it. We don't have trees so they don't get blown down.
Our houses are made of stone (my walls are 3 foot wide) and all new buildings have to have extra strengtheners in their roof strutts to put up with our wind.
So, is the difference in your wind and our wind is that your's goes in a circular motion and so has different forces/pressures while our's is a constant and little gets damaged?
I am so sorry for those in the devastation but I always wonder why the houses are built out of flimsy materials when this seems to happen on a regular basis. Why are your walls 3 foot thick too?
Francesx
Post by: gunug on May 08, 2007, 06:07:10 AM
Post by: Gregg on May 08, 2007, 07:03:58 AM
QUOTE(Gregg @ May 7 2007, 08:06 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
The experts used to advise getting out of your car and getting down to the lowest point possible if you see a tornado approaching. Now, they say you can out run it.
QUOTE(dolphin @ May 7 2007, 09:28 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I remember the announcements on the radio and tv all the time. They said if you were in your vehicle and saw a funnel cloud to pull to the side of the road and get out, lie face down in a ditch/depression and cover your head with your hands/arms. Fortunately I never had to do this.
Fortunate indeed! It probably would have killed you.
Frances, tornados do weird things. In this one, they reported a church that was leveled: no roof, no walls left behind. But the pews (bench seats - just in case) still sat in straight rows (they are usually screwed down to the floor, but rather small screws are used) AND the hymnals were still in the racks on the backs of the pews!
There are always amazing things like this, such as all the houses in a square block destroyed except one... I wish I could remember more of the unbelievable things like that I've heard over the years.
Post by: krissel on May 12, 2007, 03:36:50 AM
Very few people construct homes or buildings with the thought that a tornado will eventually come along. Those that do usually dig a shelter underground rather than put the extensive expense that would be required to outfit a home to withstand the 'average' tornado. Three foot wide stone walls are not possible or practical in most areas of our country, though I must admit the thought is appealing.
This particular storm had winds well over 200mph which very little could withstand.
The US is a country of widely differing climates and resources with each area having to deal with their own collection of natural disasters: hurricanes, floods, tornadoes, earthquakes, wildfires, blizzards, drought, etc. Oh, almost forgot volcanoes.
Makes life interesting.
Post by: gunug on May 12, 2007, 04:03:02 AM