Post by: sunset on January 18, 2008, 11:32:56 PM
At this point it is 'useable' but, according to others, it may not be for long. Have been agonizing over this for a few days now, mainly because I'm not ready to just 'toss' it and add to the proverbial electronic landfill. [Also, don't need a new computer. Love the iMacs but don't want to deal w/ Leopard. Much of the software I have would have to be replaced and I'm not ready to dish out that kind of $$$ when what I have serves me well. Thought about a refurb. but there's no way of knowing what OS has been installed--the 'store' can't/won't tell you...]
My question is this: has anyone dealt with this problem and found the two aforementioned parts at a reasonable cost on line and/or a schematic of the innards of the display so I'd know how many tubes to purchase for someone else to solder in place? Am not comfortable doing that myself and Apple charges $500+ to fix/replace it, almost the cost of a new one. They also do not allow Apple certified service centers to do that repair, at least as warranty work... go figure???!!!
If this is a rerun, I apologize. Tried doing a 'search' and came up empty-handed.
, in advance, for any thoughts/help you can think of!Laurel
Post by: Paddy on January 19, 2008, 09:02:47 AM
Generally labor alone in independent shops runs $80-$90 or more an hour IF you can find anyone willing or able to take the display apart. From what I've read, they're not really intended to be repaired; they're very difficult to take apart (without damage) and difficult to work on as well. I would check with an independent Apple dealer to be sure, but I think you're looking at more money than it's worth.You can get very good non-Apple 19/20" displays that will probably be as good or better than your five-year-old display for just over $200. I have a Dell 24" monitor that I love - the 19" version of it is a mere $210 at Dell right now. I love the look of the Apple monitors, but there are some out there that are rated as highly or better than the Apple displays. Plus my Dell has very handy card slots on it which eliminates the need for a card reader - something I really appreciate!!
PC World rated these the top 5 in the 19" category:
http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,140989-page,1/article.html
CNET top 5 19" and 20" LCDs:
http://reviews.cnet.com/4370-3174_7-258-102.html?tag=lnav
Certainly you don't need a new computer if all you really need is a new monitor (unless you were thinking of going the iMac route and this is what's giving you pause over buying a new monitor). The monitor will always be useful...and if you do go the iMac route, you can always sell the monitor.
Post by: gunug on January 19, 2008, 10:05:15 AM
Post by: Xairbusdriver on January 19, 2008, 11:19:11 AM
QUOTE
[Apple] also do not allow Apple certified service centers to do that repair, at least as warranty work.
So they can't tell the dealer not to do the repair. But that could still be more than a new, non-Apple monitor, anyway. The technology has improved in those five years and you might end up with a monitor that is even better than the crippled one ever was! BTW, the newest iMacs can drive an external monitor as an extended Dektop up to 1920 by 1200 pixels on the digital side, and higher on the analog side. So you should still be able to use the new monitor even if you buy a new iMac in the next few years.
Post by: Gregg on January 19, 2008, 03:54:33 PM
Post by: sunset on January 19, 2008, 06:00:14 PM
Our son, a graphic designer, just got a new 22" NEC monitor to use with his G5 before the Holidays that he is extremely happy with so I know I need to do some looking. Will check out your links, Paddy, and see what they recommend. My computer is a G4 MDD dual 1.25 GHz tower, sporting 10.4.10 so it's as up-to-date as it can be, almost, w/o jumping into Leopard--[which I have still sitting in the box...]
Paddy, does your Dell have a glossy or matte screen? I'm concerned about the glossy screens because my MacBook has one and the colors aren't consistant from top to bottom. Doing a lot of photo work on a matte screen keeps the colors/hues the same throughout the panel. Not sure that'll be the case with a glossy screen???
Good thoughts, everyone--certainly more to think about than my original consideration.
Post by: Paddy on January 19, 2008, 07:51:37 PM
Interesting poll results here:
http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20061018-8022.html
However, in this article and comments following, it appears that the glossy screen on a MacBook is a different kettle of fish from the glossy screen on an HP laptop (for instance) - Mac users seem to love theirs.
http://www.tuaw.com/2006/06/05/which-scree...lossy-or-matte/
Also, a key difference with the LCDs vs the laptop screens is that you don't get the really noticeable color/saturation shifts when the angle changes - or variations from top to bottom of the screen...at least not on my Dell!! I don't edit photos on my MacBook Pro if I can help it (apart from cropping etc.) and never intended to use it for that purpose.
Post by: MamaMoose on January 19, 2008, 09:32:54 PM
I am getting rid of my 4 year old 20" ADC Apple cinema Display (Bought a new Cinema Display 23" DVI ). It has been working like a charm. I would be very happy to sell it to you at a reasonable price. If you are not too far away, I'll even split the shipping cost. Send me a note on my Private E-Mail and we can discuss details.
My advice is do not pay for repairs. Even if it is fixed, another part could fail.
MamaMoose
Post by: Gregg on January 20, 2008, 01:59:06 PM
Is 2,103.84 miles "too far"?
Post by: sunset on January 20, 2008, 04:17:00 PM
It's about time for the BIG game!!!
Post by: Texas Mac Man on January 20, 2008, 07:08:48 PM
Post by: sunset on January 20, 2008, 10:54:06 PM
QUOTE(Texas Mac Man @ Jan 20 2008, 08:08 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Not good. See http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=51810
Thanks, Tom, for the link. I hadn't seen that before and, since my original post, discovered that this problem is also addressed in my G4 manual. Apple technicians barely acknowledge the problem and of course, because my monitor is beyond warranty, they really aren't interested in discussing it.
After finding out what the flashing light was telling me, I found THIS THREAD on the Apple Discussions site and took it from there. Thankfully I can use this monitor until I decide what to do, unless it takes a nose dive... I hope not!
Post by: Gregg on January 21, 2008, 07:18:59 AM
QUOTE(sunset @ Jan 20 2008, 04:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
It's about time for the BIG game!!!
They gave it a go.
Post by: Paddy on January 21, 2008, 07:37:00 AM
Meanwhile, it can't be easy to edit photos!!
Post by: sunset on January 21, 2008, 10:01:27 AM
QUOTE(Gregg @ Jan 21 2008, 08:18 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE(sunset @ Jan 20 2008, 04:17 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
It's about time for the BIG game!!!
They gave it a go.
I agree, Gregg. Can't imagine playing under those conditions let alone being able to hang on to a frozen ball. Have to give them credit for doing as well as they did. They were well matched... =(
Post by: sunset on January 21, 2008, 11:06:47 AM
QUOTE(Paddy @ Jan 21 2008, 08:37 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Interesting thread on the Apple forums about DIY repair of the monitors. The only problem is not knowing (for sure) which of the failures is causing the symptom, though given the fact that the top half of the screen is dim, I'd start with the $44 solution if you're inclined to go that route. If that doesn't work, then I'd think twice about the inverter board - at $129 and a lot of work, you're more than half way to a new monitor. Obviously, by replacing both of these parts, you'd be spending almost as much as you would on a new - and probably better - monitor. Tough decision.
Meanwhile, it can't be easy to edit photos!!
Meanwhile, it can't be easy to edit photos!!
Thanks for sticking with me through this 'trauma', Paddy...
I have checked out your links as to 'what's good' right now and read A LOT of reviews. So many indicate ghosting and light leaks along the edges of the screen as well as solid blacks, particularly, not being true black, etc. Guess I've been spoiled with this one--have one tiny 'dead' pixel in the middle of the screen but it's never really bothered me. Tried 'rubbing it out' which didn't work, of course, so just ignore it.At one time, thought the Dells were comparable to Apple displays but there are so many model #'s now, it's hard to keep track. Had heard the the '4-digit' ones were the best but don't know if that holds true any more. Too much stuff going on in my head...
Don't need anything bigger than a 20" WP. If I knew that the refurbished iMac came with Tiger, I'd go that route. Have spoken with the Apple Store a couple of times and they said that at this point only one in 20 does; so much for that thought. =(Back to the Apple Discussion group... I missed any reference to a $44 'fix'. Will try to find it and see what that might be--sounds like it's in my $$ range...
Thank you, once again, for your sage advice.
Laurel
Post by: Paddy on January 21, 2008, 01:37:47 PM
BTW - the components used in LCDs are only made by a few manufacturers; Dell and Apple use (or as of two years ago did) the same flat panel from LG Philips; the backlights are different and of course the enclosure is also different.
Here's a comparison of the Dell I have and the 23" Cinema Display:
http://www.barefeats.com/lcd.html
BTW - the $44 solution for your LCD is replacing the backlights - there are several links to the supplier in the thread, as well as discussion of difficulty etc.
Post by: sunset on January 21, 2008, 03:16:13 PM
QUOTE(Paddy @ Jan 21 2008, 02:37 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Yes - it's the 4 digit Dells that are the better ones. I've been very happy with mine and never had any issues with ghosting or light streaks. No dead pixels either.
BTW - the components used in LCDs are only made by a few manufacturers; Dell and Apple use (or as of two years ago did) the same flat panel from LG Philips; the backlights are different and of course the enclosure is also different.
Here's a comparison of the Dell I have and the 23" Cinema Display:
http://www.barefeats.com/lcd.html
BTW - the $44 solution for your LCD is replacing the backlights - there are several links to the supplier in the thread, as well as discussion of difficulty etc.
BTW - the components used in LCDs are only made by a few manufacturers; Dell and Apple use (or as of two years ago did) the same flat panel from LG Philips; the backlights are different and of course the enclosure is also different.
Here's a comparison of the Dell I have and the 23" Cinema Display:
http://www.barefeats.com/lcd.html
BTW - the $44 solution for your LCD is replacing the backlights - there are several links to the supplier in the thread, as well as discussion of difficulty etc.
Lots of good information, Paddy--thanks. Will check it out later--time to go bowling, etc. Need to get away from this for a bit...
Post by: sunset on February 15, 2008, 11:15:31 PM
After 'living' with it for a couple of weeks I finally decided to take it to our local Apple certified repair center and have their technician open it, check the florescent tubes and replace the ones that were 'out'. Time spent there got quite lengthy and I won't go into the details but, after he finally found a G5 [originally said he didn't have a machine to hook it up to...
], when it was attached and booted, the light was no longer flashing and the whole screen was back to normal/evenly lit!!!I'm sure I stood there with my mouth open and still have no clue why a bumpy car trip to the 'doctor' would 'fix' it but it did--amazing!!!. I brought it back home, crossing my fingers all the way--not really... but hoping it would remain in its 'fixed state' after hooking it back up.
It did and has and I'm delighted, to say the least, and want to thank you all for your support. Your'e the best!!
Laurel
Post by: Gregg on February 16, 2008, 09:03:23 AM
Post by: krissel on February 17, 2008, 06:03:01 AM
And let's pray it isn't a case of:
QUOTE
Disconnecting the ADC connector might reset the micro-controller, which may explain why the monitor works for a few days afterwards.
(From one of those Apple forum discussions)
Post by: Gregg on February 17, 2008, 02:14:04 PM
QUOTE(krissel @ Feb 17 2008, 06:03 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
And let's pray it isn't a case of:
(From one of those Apple forum discussions)
QUOTE
Disconnecting the ADC connector might reset the micro-controller, which may explain why the monitor works for a few days afterwards.
(From one of those Apple forum discussions)
If it works, unplug it as often as you need to! I was doing that with a VCR recently. Unplugging it resets something or 'nother. But, it got to the point where that was necessary at an intolerable frequency.
Post by: sunset on February 17, 2008, 04:35:20 PM
Actually that's pretty much what I thought must have happened. There's no way, short of a natural disaster, [heaven forbid] that this baby's going to get moved again--or bumped. 
I had read that removing and replacing the connector might reset it so that'd been done somewhere in the process of trying to figure out what was going on. Didn't work, obviously. =(
Speaking of weird stuff... anybody know why my cursor 'walks' when I'm not touching the mouse?? Have had it happen before and normally a 'restart' fixes it but not this time. Like the Energizer Bunny, it just keeps going and going and .................. Any thoughts??
Laurel
Post by: krissel on February 17, 2008, 08:25:38 PM
QUOTE
would appear to be solved by the application of alcohol+Qtip to the lense of the optical emitter and reflector. Has run several days w/o reoccurance.
guess there's some kind of refraction taking place around dirt/dust particles,
guess there's some kind of refraction taking place around dirt/dust particles,
http://www.techspot.com/vb/all/windows/t-3...use-motion.html
If that doesn't help, try a different port. Or if it is a battery operated mouse, put in new batteries.
Also be sure you don't have more than one driver or pref pane for the mouse.
Post by: sunset on February 18, 2008, 12:18:14 AM
• Cleaned the sensor with Q-tip and alcohol
• Checked the battery and signal levels; both are good/high
• Reseated the batteries
• It was plugged into the back of my ACD monitor--moved it to a powered hub
This has happened before and it's still 'walking'. Will do a restart again tomorrow an see if that helps.
Laurel
Post by: krissel on February 18, 2008, 12:26:02 AM
Post by: sunset on February 18, 2008, 01:43:32 PM
Nope, nowhere near--we live in Wisconsin.• Restarted this a.m., this time 'changed batteries'--no joy!! This is beginning to drive me crazy because the cursor never disappears and it 'jumps' with every key stroke...
Whelp... I just unplugged the Apple mouse from the keyboard [which has been there forever], and it seems to be working fine, no cursor on the screen, etc. Gosh, do we ever learn it all??
Laurel
Post by: Paddy on February 18, 2008, 02:01:11 PM
QUOTE
• It was plugged into the back of my ACD monitor--moved it to a powered hub
QUOTE
I just unplugged the Apple mouse from the keyboard [which has been there forever]
Laurel...do you mean that you've had TWO mice plugged in all along and it was the Apple mouse that was causing the "walking"? Or am I just confused? (wouldn't be the first time...)
Post by: sunset on February 18, 2008, 02:35:40 PM
QUOTE(Paddy @ Feb 18 2008, 03:01 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE
• It was plugged into the back of my ACD monitor--moved it to a powered hub
QUOTE
I just unplugged the Apple mouse from the keyboard [which has been there forever]
Laurel...do you mean that you've had TWO mice plugged in all along and it was the Apple mouse that was causing the "walking"? Or am I just confused? (wouldn't be the first time...)
No, Paddy, you're not confused... I've always had the corded one attached to the keyboard [and tucked away in the keyboard 'drawer'] to use at times when the optical mouse decided that it's batteries were dying or communication between the o.m. and its 'transceiver' had gone 'south', which was rare. Guess you're hinting that that's not a good idea??!!
L
Post by: Paddy on February 18, 2008, 03:01:44 PM
We've had two mice plugged in to one or other of our Macs at times for the same reason as you do and no issues. I suspect that something changed - mouse got moved/bumped during the disconnection of the monitor etc. If the Apple mouse is an optical one, which the newer ones are, all it would take is some dust or a hair (cat hairs are my constant annoyance) in the "eye" and you can get all sorts of funny stuff happening. At any rate, there is no need to keep the Apple mouse plugged in - you can simply plug it in when you need it.I gave up on wireless mice because I never found one I liked and found the additional weight of the batteries was just enough to cause RS type symptoms. My kids have the ones I tried and rejected - they seem to like 'em!
Post by: Paddy on February 18, 2008, 03:01:45 PM
We've had two mice plugged in to one or other of our Macs at times for the same reason as you do and no issues. I suspect that something changed - mouse got moved/bumped during the disconnection of the monitor etc. If the Apple mouse is an optical one, which the newer ones are, all it would take is some dust or a hair (cat hairs are my constant annoyance) in the "eye" and you can get all sorts of funny stuff happening. At any rate, there is no need to keep the Apple mouse plugged in - you can simply plug it in when you need it.I gave up on wireless mice because I never found one I liked and found the additional weight of the batteries was just enough to cause RS type symptoms. My kids have the ones I tried and rejected - they seem to like 'em!
Post by: Xairbusdriver on February 18, 2008, 06:04:37 PM
Or is there someone on a tread mill in the next room?
Post by: sunset on February 19, 2008, 12:00:49 AM
Paddy, my Apple mouse is just the old, one-button, corded one that came with the G4.
I'm NOT starting this thread all over again but
my monitor restarted the '2 long, 1 short' light pulses tonight. Must be time for another ride in the car. RATS!!!L.
Post by: Xairbusdriver on February 19, 2008, 05:03:01 PM
Maybe it's just "Great minds..."
Post by: Paddy on February 19, 2008, 05:12:04 PM
QUOTE
I'm NOT starting this thread all over again but my monitor restarted the '2 long, 1 short' light pulses tonight. Must be time for another ride in the car. RATS!!!
Ah...zee old intermittent hardware issue...bane of any electrical engineer (ask my hubby)/repair person; guaranteed to magically disappear when the item in question is delivered, in frustration, to the local repair shop or the repair person comes to you, and just as magically, show up some time after the trip home/repair person leaves.
My stove did that to me recently...though it seems to have cured itself (fingers crossed) - meanwhile, the Sears repair guy thinks I'm nuts.
It may be time for a new monitor - did they give you any idea of the cost of repair when you took it in?
Post by: sunset on February 19, 2008, 11:50:20 PM
QUOTE(Paddy @ Feb 19 2008, 06:12 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
QUOTE
I'm NOT starting this thread all over again but my monitor restarted the '2 long, 1 short' light pulses tonight. Must be time for another ride in the car. RATS!!!
Ah...zee old intermittent hardware issue...bane of any electrical engineer (ask my hubby)/repair person; guaranteed to magically disappear when the item in question is delivered, in frustration, to the local repair shop or the repair person comes to you, and just as magically, show up some time after the trip home/repair person leaves.
My stove did that to me recently...though it seems to have cured itself (fingers crossed) - meanwhile, the Sears repair guy thinks I'm nuts.
It may be time for a new monitor - did they give you any idea of the cost of repair when you took it in?
No, Paddy--he hadn't done it before so really he didn't know how long it would take. He thinks it's the florescent tubes and not the inverter board so he was planning on starting there.
Good luck with your stove--stranger things have happened. Just ask me... See my new plea for help... UGH!!
Laurel