Author Topic: Pogue helps clarify The HDTV Puzzle  (Read 5040 times)

Offline RHPConsult

  • TS Addict
  • Posts: 7859
    • View Profile
    • http://
Pogue helps clarify The HDTV Puzzle
« on: February 01, 2008, 01:59:22 AM »
In case you're thinking/planning/pining/strategizing/whatever here's Pogue's take on the present and approaching conundrum: LCD, plasma, projection, by 2009.


More sprightly reading than Consumer's Reports, of course.
« Last Edit: February 01, 2008, 02:04:16 AM by RHPConsult »

Offline Gregg

  • TS Addict
  • *****
  • Posts: 11748
    • View Profile
    • http://
Pogue helps clarify The HDTV Puzzle
« Reply #1 on: February 01, 2008, 07:15:38 AM »
Somebody has started at least talking about an advertising / public service announcement campaign to alert folks in Wisconsin ('up nort') who are unlikely to have cable or satellite. I guess they will also focus on inner city Milwaukee as well.
Ya gotta applaud those bunnies for sacrificing their hearing just so some guy in Cupertino can have better TV reception.

Offline Xairbusdriver

  • Administrator
  • TS Addict
  • *****
  • Posts: 26388
  • 27" iMac (mid-17), Big Sur, Mac mini, Catalina
    • View Profile
    • Mid-South Weather
Pogue helps clarify The HDTV Puzzle
« Reply #2 on: February 01, 2008, 11:03:01 AM »
This site <DTV Answers> makes things pretty simple to understand, also.
THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF COUNTRIES
Those that use metric = #1 Measurement system
And the United States = The Banana system
CAUTION! Childhood vaccinations cause adults! :yes:

Offline jcarter

  • TS Addict
  • *****
  • Posts: 5808
    • View Profile
    • http://www.jcarter.net/ourdogs/muffinpage.html
Pogue helps clarify The HDTV Puzzle
« Reply #3 on: February 01, 2008, 07:24:50 PM »
Must send this on to my brother, as he was impressed with our 40 LCD Samsung.  Which was on sale and its one wonderful thing!
I saw it reviewed here.
Jane

Offline Gregg

  • TS Addict
  • *****
  • Posts: 11748
    • View Profile
    • http://
Pogue helps clarify The HDTV Puzzle
« Reply #4 on: February 01, 2008, 09:09:39 PM »
Has everyone sent for his/her coupon for the converter box? I requested one for our old black & white TV, which we have set up in the basement, and still use all the time. It was a wedding present! Oh, did I mention it is a black & white set?

I've gotta go get gas in the Model T...
Ya gotta applaud those bunnies for sacrificing their hearing just so some guy in Cupertino can have better TV reception.

Offline Xairbusdriver

  • Administrator
  • TS Addict
  • *****
  • Posts: 26388
  • 27" iMac (mid-17), Big Sur, Mac mini, Catalina
    • View Profile
    • Mid-South Weather
Pogue helps clarify The HDTV Puzzle
« Reply #5 on: February 01, 2008, 09:47:21 PM »
I want more info on the statement that an HDTV shows analog broadcasts worse than a straight analog system. No more than I watch TV, I don't want my viewing downgraded for the next year. I hope what they are saying is that an HD set displays analog images worse than analog sets.

I can get a digital box from the cable company for nothing, but I may have to insert a converter box between the cable box and the analog set. The current crop of HDTVs are way too expensive to justify buying! eek2.gif I assume that converting the digital signal/image will also create the 'letterbox' image on an analog set, making the converted image somewhat smaller in the translation (it will be as wide as possible but the height will not need/use the screen hight of the 'old' set). dntknw.gif Maybe I should try one out now, before everyone tries to get an HDTV set next year. I'm sure that this will be the first time where the Supply vs Demand theory will fail and these new sets will drop in price. wallbash.gif tease.gif
THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF COUNTRIES
Those that use metric = #1 Measurement system
And the United States = The Banana system
CAUTION! Childhood vaccinations cause adults! :yes:

Offline krissel

  • Administrator
  • TS Addict
  • *****
  • Posts: 14735
    • View Profile
Pogue helps clarify The HDTV Puzzle
« Reply #6 on: February 02, 2008, 05:01:11 AM »
First, please understand that you are talking about two different animals here.

HDTV is High Definition TV.

DTV refers to Digital TV.

They are not the same subject.

When broadcast TV goes over to digital next year, those of us who get "over the air" transmissions via antenna will all have to have either a TV set that already has the ATSC tuner in it that receives digital content or get a box that will convert the digital signals to the analog TVs that many of us still have. If you are on cable or satellite you may still be getting an analog signal because they are not required to go digital only just yet. They can pick up the digital transmission and send it to you in analog form. But most likely they will go digital eventually if not immediately. At that point you may need a converter of some sort.

QUOTE
Analog sets connected to a cable or satellite box shouldn't require a converter. But older, so-called cable-ready TV sets (in which the cable plugs directly into the set) may need a converter box unless, as some expect, the cable company converts digital signals to analog for their analog-cable subscribers.


HDTV refers to the resolution of the image. You must have a set that is capable of receiving high def AND a high def signal. Many people who buy HDTVs are angry when they get it home and realize their signal is standard definition and they have to pay more (via cable or satellite) to get the better resolution. Though if they are going from old analog images to any digital output they would see a big improvement anyway.

As to the coupons, I signed up for mine but don't expect them to be sent out for a few weeks since the converters are not in a wide variety of stores yet. Several manufacturers have them ready but I imagine not in enough quantity to put in stores. Note that the coupons will only be good for 90 days from issue and only for the FCC approved boxes.

Will you need a new antenna to receive digital signals? Probably not if you now get a good signal from your present setup.
Here's a good way to find out.

QUOTE
You can also go to the FCC.com website, click on "Media" on the right-hand side (down just a little bit), when that page comes up, click on "Video Division, Including TV" on the left-hand side and the when the next page comes up, click on "TV Query".
When the TV Query comes up, there is a spot for "Call Sign". Put the call sign for the stations that you receive in the box (i. e. KHOU). Scroll down to the box with the various formats listed and click on "TV Query (detailed output, including CDBS links)"
Information about the station will come up. Scroll down to the section that has "Digital" to the right of the page, it will be in red. Click on "Service Contour Map" and you will get a coverage map of the usable signal for the station. This will give you an idea of how far inside (or, alas, outside) the contour you are and your chances of continuing to receive the station. You can do this for all of them. Be sure to click on the full power section or you may pull up info on a "Special Temporary Authorization" that does not indicate the final coverage for the station.


This will at least tell you if you are within the range of the signal. However you may have to redirect your antenna or get a better one if you have hilly terrain between you and the station.

I did some digging at the site because my DVR gets most of the digital signals from NYC except NBC. I found an application from them for an extension to construct a new digital antenna. When the Twin Towers came down they took all the TV stations with them. Most relocated to the Empire State Building but are sharing spots on the antenna and some are not as powerful as others. I think the NBC digital signal is just too weak to receive for me.

Here are some other links for further info.

List of accepted converters and discussion.  Note the following:

QUOTE
these converter boxes are FORBIDDEN to have any HDTV outputs (HDMI, DVI, component, TOSLINK, Digital Coax audio) whatsoever. The primary purpose is to allow the old analog TVs to receive the ATSC signals, and to that end, all they need for outputs are RF modulator, s-video, composite video, and at least 1 set RCA analog audio output jacks


http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=948767

Some have already reached stores:

http://www.radioshack.com/product/index.js...rentPage=search

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?sk...d=1199495190393

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=8343230

http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=8283870



More:

http://www.dtv.gov/

http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=704585
« Last Edit: February 02, 2008, 05:24:49 AM by krissel »


A Techsurvivors founder

Offline Gregg

  • TS Addict
  • *****
  • Posts: 11748
    • View Profile
    • http://
Pogue helps clarify The HDTV Puzzle
« Reply #7 on: February 02, 2008, 10:45:49 AM »
QUOTE
If you are on cable or satellite you may still be getting an analog signal because they are not required to go digital only just yet. They can pick up the digital transmission and send it to you in analog form. But most likely they will go digital eventually if not immediately. At that point you may need a converter of some sort.


Hmmm. The information I've read indicated that if you have cable or satellite, you would not need another box. I'm gonna call DISH about that, someday...
Ya gotta applaud those bunnies for sacrificing their hearing just so some guy in Cupertino can have better TV reception.

Offline Xairbusdriver

  • Administrator
  • TS Addict
  • *****
  • Posts: 26388
  • 27" iMac (mid-17), Big Sur, Mac mini, Catalina
    • View Profile
    • Mid-South Weather
Pogue helps clarify The HDTV Puzzle
« Reply #8 on: February 02, 2008, 11:34:24 AM »
I think part of the problem is that "HDTV" is used as both the name and type of signal as well as the type of receiver (set).

Comcast, claims they are already sending a digital signal now and all we need is a digital capable TV (HDTV). But I am currently viewing everything on analog sets. However, the box I have is quite old and I doubt it is able to actually furnish a digital signal to any TV. But I can switch to a digital box for free. My concern is that new box will not include any analog output (similar to the converter boxes only providing analog out). In that case, I would still need some kind of converter, if my current cable box dies. At that point, they may not even stock he analog boxes, although I would think that is somewhat short sighted. I suspect there will be many who refuse to buy the new sets for quite some time. Dropping those who are also customers doesn't sound like a good business plan. However, since most cable companies are virtual local monopolies, they may not really care about loosing a few. dntknw.gif

I guess you can call me the "Gregg" of TV, I don't think the visual improvements are worth the price of entry for the limited amount of TV we watch. After all, many of the shows are simply reruns, some even in black & white! eek2.gif blush-anim-cl.gif smile.gif
THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF COUNTRIES
Those that use metric = #1 Measurement system
And the United States = The Banana system
CAUTION! Childhood vaccinations cause adults! :yes:

Offline krissel

  • Administrator
  • TS Addict
  • *****
  • Posts: 14735
    • View Profile
Pogue helps clarify The HDTV Puzzle
« Reply #9 on: February 02, 2008, 11:38:02 PM »
QUOTE(Xairbusdriver @ Feb 2 2008, 12:34 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I think part of the problem is that "HDTV" is used as both the name and type of signal as well as the type of receiver (set).

Comcast, claims they are already sending a digital signal now and all we need is a digital capable TV (HDTV).


A digital capable TV is not the same as HDTV.

HD refers to a particular line quality of digital TV. A digital capable TV may or may not be able to receive HD signal. You might have to pay extra for HD quality signals from your cable company. Some charge for that above and beyond the regular fee by making you pay for a special card that goes in your cable box. If you have a QAM tuner in your TV you are set.

You will just have to ask your company what you need. Remember, for the average person digital is a major improvement and high def is just extra icing that you won't really notice unless you have one of those monster sized sets and are a videophile.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-definition_television
« Last Edit: February 02, 2008, 11:42:28 PM by krissel »


A Techsurvivors founder

Offline Gregg

  • TS Addict
  • *****
  • Posts: 11748
    • View Profile
    • http://
Pogue helps clarify The HDTV Puzzle
« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2008, 04:22:43 PM »
An article about who stands to profit from the digital broadcast conversion can be found here
Ya gotta applaud those bunnies for sacrificing their hearing just so some guy in Cupertino can have better TV reception.

Offline kcourt

  • TS Addict
  • *****
  • Posts: 908
    • View Profile
    • http://
Pogue helps clarify The HDTV Puzzle
« Reply #11 on: February 16, 2008, 05:02:23 PM »
Wish I could use a large HDTV screen, but my family room is so small that I need a 26".  I bought a Sony Bravia in December and really love it. I bought it at Best Buy, and the salesman really had all of the information to help me make the right decision. It is true that the analog programs look worse on the new TV set but I get a lot of the local stations in HD and they are really clear and bright.  yahoo.gif

I have a three month trial of all of the channels that our cable company provides (Cox), including all of the premium movie channels.  I have a converter box, which is also used to record programs.  They offer basic programs that are HD and they come free with the box (which is $4.95 per month).  Then there are tiers you can buy ($4.95 for each one).  

 yes.gif  When the three months are up, I plan to just use the basic HD, which consist of many of the local channels in HD, plus, HDTV, A&E,  Food Channel, Discovery, Mojo and several others.  They said that as the year goes on, more cable channels will add HD, which will still be free as they are included with the basic service.

Kathy flower-smilie.gif
« Last Edit: February 16, 2008, 05:02:49 PM by kcourt »
Live simply,
Love generously,
Care deeply,
Speak kindly....
Leave the rest to God