Author Topic: Browser #1 Won't Open Until Browser #2 Does  (Read 2112 times)

whoami

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Browser #1 Won't Open Until Browser #2 Does
« on: January 17, 2011, 04:39:06 PM »
The Problem: The Opera 9.64 browser will not open upon booting/rebooting the OS unless I first open the Camino 1.6.11 browser.  By "open," I mean that after clicking on the Opera icon in my Dock, Opera launches a big white window and that's it - the home page I set in its Preferences pane never loads - and then I see the infamous (but colorful) cursor.  After opening Camino, I can open and close Opera without a problem, even after quitting Camino.  Currently, this is the pattern that I have to follow if I want to use Opera.

The Notes: I tried to locate a default browser setting within the Opera Preferences menu, but could not find one.  Camino has one and I set it to show Opera as the default browser.  I'm not sure if this is a network setting issue, but if it is, Opera has options for configuring Proxies...I just don't know how to proceed.  My connection to the Internet is by way of cable modem and my ISP has it configured to use DHCP under the Configure IPv4 menu, which is found within the TCP/IP menu of my OS's Network pane.  I have and will continue to search for solutions on the Internet.

The Questions: Does anyone know why this is happening and how I can solve this problem?  If possible, I would really like to use Opera as my primary browser without the cumbersome pattern.

Thank you.
« Last Edit: January 18, 2011, 07:15:08 PM by whoami »

Offline Xairbusdriver

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Browser #1 Won't Open Until Browser #2 Does
« Reply #1 on: January 17, 2011, 06:39:42 PM »
Your default Browser setting is probably in Safari. Also, your email app setting is probably in Mail. At least that's what Apple did by the time Tiger came out. I have no idea what was in Jaguar.

Still, it sounds more like a cache type problem. As if the OS wasn't seeing your DNS settings until Camino accesses the interwebs. dntknw.gif wacko.gif

This might help:
    1. Open Network Prefs
    2. Copy (write or take screen shots) of every single setting on every single tab.
    3. Close Preferences
    4. Move /Library/Preferences/SystemConfiguration/preference.plist if you have one.
    5. Re-open Network Prefs and reset stuff to the previous values.
THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF COUNTRIES
Those that use metric = #1 Measurement system
And the United States = The Banana system
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Offline Paddy

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Browser #1 Won't Open Until Browser #2 Does
« Reply #2 on: January 17, 2011, 07:47:45 PM »
Before you delete any .plist files, you could also try setting the default browser to Opera in Safari's preferences. I don't know who is "king" in the browser dept., but I suspect it is Safari, not Camino. wink.gif

That said, I've never heard of this problem and cannot find any other reference to it.

Try cleaning caches - Onyx would make that easier than trying to find them all by hand.
« Last Edit: January 17, 2011, 08:15:05 PM by Paddy »
"If computers get too powerful, we can organize them into committees. That'll do them in." ~Author unknown •iMac 5K, 27" 3.6Ghz i9 (2019) • 16" M1 MBP(2021) • 9.7" iPad Pro • iPhone 13

whoami

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Browser #1 Won't Open Until Browser #2 Does
« Reply #3 on: January 17, 2011, 10:24:18 PM »
Xairbusdriver and Paddy,

Thank you both for responding and for your suggestions.  I examined the preferences.plist file with a text editor (Pico) and discovered that most of what's in there is network related "stuff."  I tried moving it to the Desktop but it won't budge.  So, I copied it to that location and deleted the one in the System Configuration directory.  Then, I placed the desktop copy back into the directory; I read online that to reinstall the Apple Studio Display factory installed color profile for ColorSync (for those who have a habit of deleting things), one should do what I described but to the entire Preferences directory and it worked (the directory was "rebuilt" and the factory color profile was reinserted).  Regrettably, that didn't happen this time: the problem still exists.  I may delete the entire thing, then create a blank file with the same name, and then manually reset my Network pane to its original settings.

Regarding the browser cache, Opera had been set to clear its cache upon closing and I still have the problem.  Anyways, prior to making my first post for this problem, I had already set Opera as the default browser inside of Safari's Preferences pane.  Now, about Safari...well, I deleted it and the reason is because I really thought it was causing the problem; I was also having other issues with it.  By the way, I downloaded OnyX and will spend more time with that in the upcoming days.

I'll do more searching on the Internet.

Thank you.
« Last Edit: February 06, 2011, 03:22:00 PM by whoami »

Offline Paddy

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Browser #1 Won't Open Until Browser #2 Does
« Reply #4 on: January 18, 2011, 12:14:06 AM »
Whoami, I'm a bit confused. You copied the .plist file to the Desktop...and then you put the copy back into the directory? If you did that, it's the same file, so nothing would change. Since it doesn't budge, you may have to try the replacement with a blank file idea.

But...before you do, create another user, log in to that account and see if the problem reoccurs. At least that will help narrow down whether this is an issue specific to one user account or all.
"If computers get too powerful, we can organize them into committees. That'll do them in." ~Author unknown •iMac 5K, 27" 3.6Ghz i9 (2019) • 16" M1 MBP(2021) • 9.7" iPad Pro • iPhone 13

Offline Paddy

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« Reply #5 on: January 18, 2011, 07:07:31 AM »
More thoughts...

Have you tried to move the .plist to the Trash? I just did it and was asked for my administrator password. Allowed me to do it after I put in the password. When I went to put it back, I got a message that I wasn't allowed to modify the system files, but there was an authenticate button, which once again required me to put in my pw and then it was allowed back in the folder where it belonged. So...did you try that? When I attempted to move the .plist file to another place on the system (my Documents folder) it just copied it - no request for PW at all, and the original remained where it was, so it would appear that you're seeing standard behavior for a system folder item. You don't have to empty the Trash - just see if the problem goes away. If it does, all you need to do is re-enter whatever prefs you'd changed using the System Preference panel - don't put the defective .plist back!

If you're concerned about a custom color profile, then those can be copied and saved and then put back in, but I don't think they get deleted or changed when you move the .plist in question. Could be wrong - I didn't look, but the profiles live here: /Users/<username>/Library/ColorSync/Profiles and you can always copy the one you're using to another place in case you need to replace it. Note: you should ALWAYS calibrate your monitor for color work - even if you only use Apple's built-in System Prefs tools to do it. Do the calibration in "expert mode" - it may surprise you how much things change (or not). Every monitor is different and they will lose calibration over time and you should periodically re-calibrate. Don't rely on profiles from the manufacturer. Profiles from commercial printers are different, of course - they're to allow you to see a good representation of what the printer will produce...but that's another subject entirely.
"If computers get too powerful, we can organize them into committees. That'll do them in." ~Author unknown •iMac 5K, 27" 3.6Ghz i9 (2019) • 16" M1 MBP(2021) • 9.7" iPad Pro • iPhone 13

Offline Xairbusdriver

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Browser #1 Won't Open Until Browser #2 Does
« Reply #6 on: January 18, 2011, 10:12:53 AM »
When changing any System owned file (moving, deleting, renaming, etc.) you should be asked for an Administrator password. That's just one reason there should be a password on any Administrator account. eek2.gif and that means an actual group of characters, not just a "return" character. Otherwise, anyone and everyone can make changes to anything and everything on the machine. rolleyes.gif

Many times in the past, we were told to "Trash" a file to see if it was the source of a problem. But the "Trash" is not where most people actually store anything they value! What was really meant was to move a file so the application or OS didn't 'see' it were it was expected to be. When that happens, the application or the OS simply creates a new copy of that file. Of course, any settings you may have changed will be lost (unless you wrote them down before the change).

So, one has at least three choices: Delete (Trash), Move or Change the name of a file. If any of those actions are performed on a System owned file, you should be asked for an Administrator password. Otherwise, the action is just carried out. I prefer the latter two actions, nothing is destroyed and the application or OS simply creates a new file. You don't even need to make a copy of the original.

Important caveats:
1. The application doesn't have to be Quit before making these changes, usually. But it's safer to do so. And, generally, the info in these files is read when the app starts up, so a restart of the app is probably required.
2. You don't usually "Quit" the OS when these changes are made. But that only means that a Restart is more likely to be needed. Just like an app, the OS usually reads these files when it starts up, so it won't see the changes made until it does that.

I apologize for leaving these instructions in my previous post. blush-anim-cl.gif Furst erer uv thee yeer!

And, I also didn't remember the protective behavior of the OS of making a duplicate of its owned files rather than allowing us to just move them. But that only means we need to be more determined about who is controlling whom! The OS will allow us to delete one of its files, we just need to give it a password...and then say, "There! Now who's boss?!" rofl.gif I do recommend using a polite voice when making that statement, however. You do remember that there is a microphone listening to everything you say to your computer, right? eek2.gif Even though we are the "boss," we want the computer to like us! yes.gif

"HAL. HAL? Please open the hatch, HAL."
« Last Edit: January 18, 2011, 10:13:19 AM by Xairbusdriver »
THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF COUNTRIES
Those that use metric = #1 Measurement system
And the United States = The Banana system
CAUTION! Childhood vaccinations cause adults! :yes:

whoami

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Browser #1 Won't Open Until Browser #2 Does
« Reply #7 on: January 18, 2011, 12:09:55 PM »
Paddy and Xairbusdriver,

Thank you both for your patience and for your detailed explanations.  I've learned things that I never knew and this has produced some interesting results that I hope will lead me one step closer to the solution...
  1. First, I moved "preferences.plist" into the Trash.  In my case, it didn't ask me for an administrator's password but it actually moved the file to that location - this is the first time that I have experienced this type of move (...where the original item is moved from one location and placed in another - not simply copied, without moving the original item).
  2. Then, I just thought I'd see what happens when I try clicking on Opera in the Dock, but only the same behavior as before occurred.
  3. Next, I opened up the Network pane in System Preferences, noticed that my settings were gone (based on what I learned today, this came as no surprise), then I reset everything, and finally, closed the pane.
  4. At this point, I clicked on Opera to see if it would now work and it did...but let's not get too excited because the real test is whether it will open upon a boot/reboot.  But, before proceeding, I checked to see if a new "preferences.plist" file was placed into the System Configuration directory by the OS and it was.  With this assurance, I emptied the Trash before proceeding to the final step.
  5. Now, I restarted the computer, clicked on Opera in the Dock...and the same inoperative behavior occurred.
Well, last night I notice that at the top of Opera's window,  in the Title Bar (centered, of all things...), was the following number/symbol sequence: "1241:916."  This sequence precedes the title of the websites that I navigate to.

This number/symbol sequence has been on (so far) every website that I go to when I use Opera - of course, after opening it using the cumbersome method I described in my original post for this thread.  Anyways, I never notice that before, otherwise I would have informed everyone.  I'll continue to do more research on the meaning of this and report what I find.

Thank you both for your help.
« Last Edit: January 18, 2011, 01:53:53 PM by whoami »

Offline Xairbusdriver

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« Reply #8 on: January 18, 2011, 01:01:26 PM »
I suggest that we stop and regroup. wink.gif We (I, anyway) need to be sure what "plist" we are working with. There are thousands of them and some can affect multiple things. So...
1. Exactly what file does "preferences.plist" refer to?
2. Is Opera installed on your Dock or simply showing there when you have started Opera? In other words, when you "Quit" Opera, is there still an icon for it on your Dock?

As for what appears in the title bar of Opera, it should be whatever the html page has between the <title> and </title> tags. If those tags are missing, I think it should be whatever the actual file name for that page is. What you describe in that area is strange, to say the least. I'm leaning toward a problem in Opera more and more.

Despite what I said about "stopping and regrouping"... blush-anim-cl.gif
Opera has preference file(s) which you might try moving (and I really do not recommend moving anything to the Trash unless you intend to delete it...) and you can just as well rename a plist file (maybe just add "old." between the "." and whatever the suffix might be). wink.gif And that file will not be in the System area, it will be in your user/Library/Preferences/ area. There is probably a folder labeled "Opera Preferences" with the various files in there. I don't have Opera installed, but the last time I did, it left a folder with well over a dozen files, but none is specifically labeled with the "plist" suffix.
THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF COUNTRIES
Those that use metric = #1 Measurement system
And the United States = The Banana system
CAUTION! Childhood vaccinations cause adults! :yes:

Offline Paddy

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« Reply #9 on: January 18, 2011, 01:48:38 PM »
Whoami, have you managed to get the Opera Build number into the title bar? Apparently you can do that...

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/sear...p;client=safari

*using the cached version of the page so that you can actually find the entry about this. It's a longshot that this is what is happening, but I can't find anything else on this strange phenomenon.

Um...have you tried trashing Opera entirely and re-downloading it by any chance? Or at least tossing its .plist file?
~/Library/Preferences/com.operasoftware.Opera.plist.

Also I just realized something - what version of Opera are you using?? For 10.3.9, you should be using Opera 9. I'm not sure what "2.6.4" refers to, but it sure isn't a version of Opera that runs on OS X! blink.gif

And while we're on the subject of mysterious things - I really don't know why you were not asked for an administrator password when trashing that preferences file if it was the one that Jim was referring to. Are you sure it was the right one?

And back to one of my other suggestions - have you tried creating and using another user account to see if the problems still occur.
"If computers get too powerful, we can organize them into committees. That'll do them in." ~Author unknown •iMac 5K, 27" 3.6Ghz i9 (2019) • 16" M1 MBP(2021) • 9.7" iPad Pro • iPhone 13

whoami

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Browser #1 Won't Open Until Browser #2 Does
« Reply #10 on: January 18, 2011, 08:44:11 PM »
Xairbusdriver and Paddy,

Ok, I'm back.  I had so much to do, but I'll try to inform you of what I've learned so far.

Opera does function correctly when I use another account.  Four people have privileges on this computer: root, administrator, user 1, and finally user 2.  The first three belong to me; the fourth one (user 2) does not, but I accessed it to try out Paddy's advice that she had asked me in an earlier post (but that I forgot about).  Opera works when I boot/reboot into user 2's account without even having to open Camino, which has been my goal but for my own account.  However, I still see the number/symbol sequence 1241:916 in the Title bar of the Opera browser window when using Opera in user 2's account.  I went to the Opera website and typed that sequence into their search box, but could not find anything.  When I typed it into Google earlier today, or late last night, but preceded by the word "Error," I found something pertaining to Windows (for PC's); however, it only refers to the number 1241: http://www.restoreguard.com/p/error-1241.h...CFQNrKgodcX-GIw

Also, about the version of Opera.  I made a mistake in communicating that information and have since corrected the original post for this thread.  The version should have been 9.64 instead of 2.64, and the build for this version (9.64) is 5270.  Thank you, Paddy, for catching that mistake.

About the .plist file, I used the one that Xairbusdriver referred to in step 4 of post 2 of this thread and, sadly, I am sure that was the one (I wish I was wrong).  Xairbusdriver, I will try locating and moving the .plist for Opera and see if that corrects the problem.  Also, the Opera icon was already in the Dock before I clicked on it; I placed the icon there.

I have not tried trashing and re-downloading Opera 9.64, but I may have to try that unless something I've shared above leads either of you to the source of this problem.  After that, let's stop.

Thank you both for trying to help me; I really mean that.
« Last Edit: January 18, 2011, 11:26:44 PM by whoami »

whoami

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Browser #1 Won't Open Until Browser #2 Does
« Reply #11 on: January 18, 2011, 09:55:04 PM »
Xairbusdriver and Paddy,

I found the .plist file for Opera in my user/Library/Preferences's directory and moved it into the Trash; I didn't empty the Trash, I just wanted to hide the file from Opera.  Then, I clicked on the Opera icon in the Dock and it started; But when I tried this after restarting the computer, it didn't: instead, the same problem occurred.  In the end, I deleted the browser.  I'll just use Camino until I find a better replacement.

Thank you both again for your patience and for trying to help me.

Take care.
« Last Edit: January 19, 2011, 09:52:35 AM by whoami »

Offline Xairbusdriver

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Browser #1 Won't Open Until Browser #2 Does
« Reply #12 on: January 19, 2011, 03:22:10 PM »
Well, that certainly is one way to "fix" a problem app! rofl.gif I often tell people who are complaining about what happens when they do something to simply stop doing it! Of course, that's not always good advice if the "something" is using our Mac's! eek2.gif At least we've confirmed that the problem is in Opera...almost, anyway. It actually could be a conflict with something in the OS that only shows up in Opera...when the Moon is in just the right place... wallbash.gif But it will be interesting to see how a newer version runs when you upgrade the OS.

And now, back to enjoying your Max! salute.gif
THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF COUNTRIES
Those that use metric = #1 Measurement system
And the United States = The Banana system
CAUTION! Childhood vaccinations cause adults! :yes: