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Author Topic: Massive "System" size  (Read 1380 times)

Offline Xairbusdriver

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Massive "System" size
« on: October 25, 2020, 10:12:26 AM »
Finally got my Mac mini back from local (Apple Authorized) AppleCare repair. All it needed was a new power supply, HD and motherboard. Other than that, everything was fine. :wacko:

It left with Mojave (10.14.6). It returned with Sierra (10.12.6). First update to Mojave failed due to 'missing files'. Went the extra mile to take it one step at a time by updating to 10.13.x and the to 10.14.6.

CCC suggested using Migration Manager in this situation. At least that's what I remember reading. (This all happened as I moved to a new hosting company)

I now have a monstrously full 1TB drive! Only 64.16 GB available! I'm sure there are multiple remnants of the old OS's files and hopefully duplicates of other cruft hat can be found and dumped. I've been using the About This Mac->Storage->Manage to delete lots of stuff (mostly copies of monthly videos from 2018, 19 & 20 that I didn't even know where around! So far, I've managed to get the usable space DOWN to 63.03! :wallbash: So much for Apple's "management" tools. :coolio: The last "large" file is "Music Creation" at 2.33 GB. Selecting "Remove..." just confirms that the task cannot be undone, but fails to accept my repeated use of the "Remove" button. :doh:
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And the United States = The Banana system
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Offline jchuzi

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Re: Massive "System" size
« Reply #1 on: October 25, 2020, 10:36:31 AM »
Do you have a bootable clone? You may be able to boot from it and delete that file from there. Otherwise, I suggest phoning Apple Tech Support. In my experience, they have been excellent. The phone number is (800) 275-2273‬
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Jon

macOS 11.7.10, iMac Retina 5K 27-inch, late 2014, 3.5 GHz Intel Core i5, 1 TB fusion drive, 16 GB RAM, Epson SureColor P700, Photoshop CC, Lightroom CC, MS Office 365

Offline Xairbusdriver

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Re: Massive "System" size
« Reply #2 on: October 25, 2020, 01:14:10 PM »
I've booted from one CCC drive and waiting on doing that from another.

One problem with looking at the size of the "System" in the Storage section of the About This Mac is that it includes items that are not actually directly part of the OS but are used by the System; app caches, Time Machine Snapshots (that are supposed to delete themselves after a real Time machine backup), Containers, etc., etc.

A call/chat with support may be the final option. I'd like to just do a restore from one of the two CC Clones that date from the day I took the mini in for repairs 20 days ago.
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THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF COUNTRIES
Those that use metric = #1 Measurement system
And the United States = The Banana system
CAUTION! Childhood vaccinations cause adults! :yes:

Offline Xairbusdriver

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Re: Massive "System" size
« Reply #3 on: October 25, 2020, 05:03:06 PM »
1. Found lots of Time Machine "Snapshots" but still can't get the "Remove" buttons to work.
2. Also Spotlight built a database (".Spotlight-V-100", "Store-V2") using 95.4 GB. I'm going to add as much of the drive into the System Preferences->Spotlight->Privacy list. That will stop Spotlight from indexing but I don't think it will change the space it is already using. :dntknw:
3. CCC is actually the largest space 'gobler'; "_CCC SafetyNet" itself is using 672 GB!! :WOW: Need to investigate how to trim that!!! :yes:
4. The good news, I guess, is that DaisyDisk shows "System" as only using 6.4 GB. 6.3 GB is just for Library which makes sense.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2020, 06:38:09 PM by Xairbusdriver »
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Offline jchuzi

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Re: Massive "System" size
« Reply #4 on: October 26, 2020, 06:01:59 AM »
I also had the CCC safety net grow like Topsy. To adjust it, launch CCC and click Advanced Settings. You can adjust the SafetyNet pruning from there. Also, while booted from your internal drive, you can trash the Safety Net data that resides in the clone.

FWIW, I have CCC set to prune the safety net after seven days, so it never gets too big.
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Jon

macOS 11.7.10, iMac Retina 5K 27-inch, late 2014, 3.5 GHz Intel Core i5, 1 TB fusion drive, 16 GB RAM, Epson SureColor P700, Photoshop CC, Lightroom CC, MS Office 365

Offline Xairbusdriver

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Re: Massive "System" size
« Reply #5 on: October 26, 2020, 10:17:10 AM »
Thanks, I'll take a look at that.

I have the Creation and Retention set to "OFF" and there are no Snapshots showing in the list just above that section of the window. I wonder when those 672 GB worth of snapshots were made? Would seem logical to delete without harm...

EDIT: According to the CCC FAQ, migrating from a CCC backup can result in the transfer of the SafetyNet files. The "_CCC SafetyNet" folder is on the CCC backup drive. The "trick" is to put that folder in the Trash before using the drive for migration. After the migration, return the "_CCC SafetyNet" folder to its normal location. I've sent a request to Mr. Bombich to confirm my interpretation. :coolio:

I now have about 3 times the available space as I started out with: 194.9 GB out of 1 TB.
« Last Edit: October 26, 2020, 04:49:19 PM by Xairbusdriver »
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Offline Xairbusdriver

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Re: Massive "System" size
« Reply #6 on: October 27, 2020, 11:26:07 AM »
As usual, the folks at CCC were quick and reassuring with their confirmation to simply delete the un-needed _CCC SafetyNet folder on the boot drive! Great support team there! :yes: :WOW:

Deleted all but one of the _CCC SafetyNet folder snapshots (5.9 GB), the last one made prior to the mini going 'off-line'. It took a very long time for the 1,777,xxx files to be deleted with Finder. I suspect DaisyDisk would have been faster. CCC could not 'see' the folder since it had not created the files on this drive. The app created them on the CCC backup drive, but I didn't want to delete any of those just yet. They were placed on the boot drive simply because Migration Assistant moved them, along with everything else, from the CCC backup drive. Seems MA is not much 'smarter' than I am. :ohmy:

Bottom line; the 1 TB drive now has 813.x GB free space!!! :yahoo: I will probably enable Snapshots...
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THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF COUNTRIES
Those that use metric = #1 Measurement system
And the United States = The Banana system
CAUTION! Childhood vaccinations cause adults! :yes:

Offline Paddy

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Re: Massive "System" size
« Reply #7 on: October 27, 2020, 11:56:35 PM »
I was wondering why your _CCC SafetyNet folder was on your Mac Mini's hard drive! One of my backups has a similarly large folder - apparently I hadn't trimmed that one! It has now been cut down to size (thanks for the tips on that Jon!).

Glad you managed to recover all the space, Jim. So...was fixing all that stuff on the mini cheaper than buying a new(er) one? Just curious. Replacing the logic board on my 2014 iMac last year made no sense - the repair would have cost more than buying a working used replacement. :p Of course, I also refused to do the repair because after talking to a Mac dealer/reseller who I've known for a long time, the possibility of it actually being the display that was the issue was raised. The repair place, in which I've lost all faith, said they couldn't be *sure* that it was the logic board until they actually put a new one IN. Still waiting for the same model 2014 iMac to turn up at the reseller as a trade or repair to attempt a swap/test. ;)
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"If computers get too powerful, we can organize them into committees. That'll do them in." ~Author unknown •iMac 5K, 27" 3.6Ghz i9 (2019) • 16" M1 MBP(2021) • 9.7" iPad Pro • iPhone 13

Offline Xairbusdriver

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Re: Massive "System" size
« Reply #8 on: October 28, 2020, 10:03:19 AM »
My reply #5 explains how the _CCC SafetyNet folder and its 672 GB of files got onto my drive and the "trick" to avoid it. This will only happen if you use a CCC backup drive as the source AND use Migration Assistant to move the files. You can find information about this at: bombich.com/kb/ccc5/frequently-asked-questions-about-carbon-copy-cloner-safetynet

BTW, when you select a volume, in the Volumes list, you should see a "Snapshot Creation and Retention" area in the lower, right-hand part of the CCC window. When you enable the CCC Snapshots, you have five editable fields that will specify how and when those files will be stored or deleted.

As for costs, I bought the mini in April of 2018. I also bought AppleCare for it. So, the only cost for the work was paid ~2.5 years ago. If this same problem occurs after next April, 2021, I will definitely be going a different way. :yes:

I hope to have a 1TB (OWC) SSD arriving by the end of the week. When that is installed, it will become the boot drive.

The mini is operating fine now, but I can't seem to set up FTP properly in the special weather reporting app. :wallbash: Until I get that working, the weather site remains out of service except for off-site links.
« Last Edit: October 28, 2020, 10:24:23 AM by Xairbusdriver »
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Offline Paddy

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Re: Massive "System" size
« Reply #9 on: October 28, 2020, 07:44:18 PM »
Ah - under AppleCare, it makes sense! Needless to say, no AC on a 6-year-old iMac. :p

I likely would have stumbled across this issue with the _CCCSafetyNet folder as well except that I had the SSD out of the 2014 iMac back and used that for the migration, I think.

Also - I'd forgotten the thing that actually made me lose faith in the repair place - it wasn't the logic board bit per se - they put that in and then called me to say it STILL didn't work properly - there were now lines on the display. Did a bit of research and found out that this symptom could be caused by improper handling of the display during removal - because it was absolutely FINE before it just went toes up. They of course, insisted that since they hadn't seen it before it went toes up, there was no guarantee it hadn't been bad to begin with (ie: maybe I was lying) and things went downhill from there. A $1100 repair had suddenly ballooned to over $1600 and they refused to take any responsibility for it, nor were they willing to guarantee that it WAS actually the screen - I pointed out to them that it could actually also be a bad logic board (the replacement!). The problem is, determining exactly what is wrong sometimes requires the ability to swap in parts, and parts for 4K 2014 27" iMacs aren't usually sitting around the repair shop "just in case"... but I wasn't going to keep paying an ever-increasing bill while they kept messing around.
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"If computers get too powerful, we can organize them into committees. That'll do them in." ~Author unknown •iMac 5K, 27" 3.6Ghz i9 (2019) • 16" M1 MBP(2021) • 9.7" iPad Pro • iPhone 13

Offline Xairbusdriver

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Re: Massive "System" size
« Reply #10 on: October 28, 2020, 08:23:40 PM »
Quote
I wasn't going to keep paying an ever-increasing bill while they kept messing around.
What?!! You don't want to support small businesses?!! O, the shame!!!! :laughhard:

The single Apple Store in Memphis, is still closed. I assume they all are, in America, anyway. The only "Apple Authorized" repair facility has been around for at least 10 years. They did claim to be having to "discuss" with Apple about getting the parts they wanted. Still, it took well over two weeks before they started calling me rather than vice versa. That one "update" call came exactly one day before the "It's ready for pickup." call. :Thinking: :coolio: :dntknw:
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THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF COUNTRIES
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And the United States = The Banana system
CAUTION! Childhood vaccinations cause adults! :yes:
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