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Author Topic: OT: Grammar Police  (Read 7926 times)

Offline Gregg

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OT: Grammar Police
« on: December 06, 2006, 07:29:14 AM »
Headline in today's paper (just an example of this question):

"Couple Give Family a New Beginning"

Is "Give" correct, or should it be "Gives"?
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Offline Bruce_F

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OT: Grammar Police
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2006, 09:13:26 AM »
QUOTE(Gregg @ Dec 6 2006, 05:29 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Headline in today's paper (just an example of this question):

"Couple Give Family a New Beginning"

Is "Give" correct, or should it be "Gives"?



In my book, it should be "Gives".
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-Bruce-

Offline Xairbusdriver

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OT: Grammar Police
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2006, 09:31:30 AM »
I can see an arguement for a 'couple' being a single entity, but "gives" seems to be quite usable in any circumstance, regardless of the number providing the 'gift'. But, I ain't no expert! flower-smilie.gif Of course, 'headlines' are not the most useful examples for demonstrating correct grammar! At best they are informative or amusing. smile.gif
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Offline kbeartx

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OT: Grammar Police
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2006, 09:33:14 AM »
IMO, this is kind of a grey area;  'couple', while a singular noun, is made up of two people, so it can go either way.  

Compare the way 'data' and 'company' are used by some as singular and others as plural.
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Offline D76

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OT: Grammar Police
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2006, 09:38:08 AM »
Depends on the paper's style book, whether couple (and pair) is considered a collective noun, like data: "The data say gas prices will increase." Sounds weird, but it's correct because datum is the singular.

The Globe and Mail uses couple as a plural. The Toronto Sun uses it as singular. The plural usage is more British side of the pond. You'd find "government are" in any British online paper. Strange, though, that couple would be considered a collective noun in a U.S. paper. Maybe a Brit wrote the headline and it slipped past (or the head wouldn't fit with an "s" on it).

Edit: kbeartx beat me to it with "data."
« Last Edit: December 06, 2006, 09:43:14 AM by D76 »
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Offline Frances144

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OT: Grammar Police
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2006, 09:53:59 AM »
To me it is really "gives",

Reasoning?
Couple is a single noun
Couples is a plural noun

He (single) gives
They (pl) give

QED, Couple gives blah blah...

Could be wrong, though.  English is hardly my first language.  Chocolate is.
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Offline jcarter

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OT: Grammar Police
« Reply #6 on: December 06, 2006, 10:11:04 AM »
I would guess "give" because family is singular.

Couple give to family  or
Couple gives to families
 
Like "he gave one to you and me"
 not "he gave one to you and I"    take out the 'you and' and it becomes
'he gave one to me' or 'he gave one to I'.   'me' is correct I would think.
I am not very good at figuring this stuff out, so this is just a guess.
Jane
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Offline jepinto

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OT: Grammar Police
« Reply #7 on: December 06, 2006, 10:12:38 AM »
QUOTE(Frances144 @ Dec 6 2006, 10:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
....... English is hardly my first language.  Chocolate is.

 clap.gif  wub.gif yum.gif flower-smilie.gif
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Offline kbeartx

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OT: Grammar Police
« Reply #8 on: December 06, 2006, 10:18:54 AM »
QUOTE(jcarter @ Dec 6 2006, 10:11 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
I would guess "give" because family is singular...I am not very good at figuring this stuff out, so this is just a guess.


The plurality or singularity of the sentence's object is not at issue; it depends on the subject, in this case 'couple'.

He gives; they give.

 - KB
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Offline dolphin

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OT: Grammar Police
« Reply #9 on: December 06, 2006, 10:56:18 AM »
ughhh!!! Way to go Gregg, this give me a headache.

or is it...gave me a headache; or possibly has given; or gives!

It could be a matter of tense! See, now what you've done... dry.gif  doh.gif  nono.gif  taped.gif
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Offline kbeartx

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OT: Grammar Police
« Reply #10 on: December 06, 2006, 11:03:02 AM »
QUOTE(dolphin @ Dec 6 2006, 10:56 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
...It could be a matter of tense! ...

 Roy, you are WAY too tense!  

No wonder you have a headache...relax!  coolio.gif
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Offline sandbox

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OT: Grammar Police
« Reply #11 on: December 06, 2006, 11:43:25 AM »
, this give me a headache
,they give me a headache
,those give me a headache


"Couple Give Family a New Beginning"
"they Give Family a New Beginning"

Dyslexic

Beginning New a Family Gives Couple the letter S wink.gif
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Offline pendragon

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OT: Grammar Police
« Reply #12 on: December 06, 2006, 11:50:42 AM »
"...New Beginning"

Is that not redundant, or at least awkward?
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Offline jwboyd

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OT: Grammar Police
« Reply #13 on: December 06, 2006, 11:55:47 AM »
A couple of days ago I resisted commenting on someone else's post about a trip to Vegas. (I don't remember who posted it, and I'm too lazy to look it up.)

But it seems to fit this topic. The comment was, "Neither of us gambol." Some do go to Vegas to gambol, while others go there to gamble.

Now for the question of whether "neither" is singular or plural. Is it "neither of us gambol." or "Neither of us gambols."?

 huh.gif

P.S. Does it really make all that much difference, so long as the meaning is clear?
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Offline Gregg

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OT: Grammar Police
« Reply #14 on: December 06, 2006, 12:11:47 PM »
QUOTE(Frances144 @ Dec 6 2006, 09:53 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
To me it is really "gives",

Reasoning?
Couple is a single noun
Couples is a plural noun


DING DING DING DING

We have a winner!

That's exactly why I think the headline is wrong.
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