Author Topic: Old Snow Airport Not Recognized  (Read 3291 times)

Offline chriskleeman

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Old Snow Airport Not Recognized
« on: May 16, 2007, 01:00:38 PM »
I just sent my sister my old Snow Airport (811.b) as she was having the usual Mac dropouts and slow connections with her Netgear Wireless Router.

I was helping her through the Airport Admin Utility, and then also the Airport Set-up Assistant, and neither one will recognize the Airport. We tried scanning, setting up an existing Airport, new Airport, etc... I cannot get her computer to recognize the Airport no matter what we try in those two Utilities. She is online with it, however, and it is showing up in the Finder Signal Strength icon in the top bar.

So what's the deal? She lives in a very congested area, and I was trying to set up the Airport for WEP security. Can't do if it's not recognized...

To me, this sounds like an issue with the Base Station Software vs. what's in her MacBook... It's hard to help her over the phone but this is what it would seem like to me.

Thoughts? Suggestions?

TIA,

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Offline Mayo

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Old Snow Airport Not Recognized
« Reply #1 on: May 16, 2007, 01:58:17 PM »
I have never been able to wireless access my Airport Express in order to set it up... I have always had to connect to the AE using an Ethernet cable.  It then shows up in the Airport Admin Utility and I can configure it.

So my suggestion is to have your sister connect via Ethernet and see if that solves the problem...

Offline gunug

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Old Snow Airport Not Recognized
« Reply #2 on: May 16, 2007, 03:17:10 PM »
I agree with Mayo, any wireless router or access port is easier to setup with a wired connection.  I can view the Airport Extreme we have in one of the schools just fine but I can't count on being about to make changes at any given time.  I have also had to push the reset button in order for it to come back from never-never-land!  Chris, where's she at, maybe someone here at TS lives nearby?
« Last Edit: May 16, 2007, 03:28:56 PM by gunug »
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Offline Xairbusdriver

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Old Snow Airport Not Recognized
« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2007, 04:12:02 PM »
I won't argue that it may be easier to access the AE via ethernet, but doing it that way is simply ridiculous! There's obviously something, probably on her machine that is incorrect. I don't think new macs even come with an ethernet cable anymore. She should be able to connect via her AirPort card. Assuming it is ON.

OTOH, if you shipped it to her, it could easily been shaken rather hard ( can you say, "Oops, I hope there wasn't anything fragile in that box!" ). It would be great to have you see if it still worked on your computer...how far is the drive? smile.gif
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Offline Mayo

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Old Snow Airport Not Recognized
« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2007, 04:33:25 PM »
QUOTE
but doing it that way is simply ridiculous


That's right, just keep trying to do something that hasn't worked after several tries... At the same time, curse Apple because the base station obviously isn't functioning as it was intended!

On the other hand, you can try the Ethernet fix and quickly determine if there is a problem with the base station. Ethernet cables are cheap at Radio Shack.

I don't care who makes the wireless gear... Apple, Netgear, you name it.  Wireless is still an evolving technology and it doesn't always work as intended. The main problem that I have encountered in recent years is an inability to make the first wireless connection in order to set-up the router. Using an Ethernet connection usually solves the problem and then the router works as intended.  I don't always need to know why something works... give me a simple, inexpensive fix and I will generally be a Happy Camper.

Offline jepinto

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Old Snow Airport Not Recognized
« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2007, 06:39:13 PM »
EVERY wireless router I've dealt with has LARGE letters telling the user to not try resetting it via wireless.
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Offline chriskleeman

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Old Snow Airport Not Recognized
« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2007, 10:45:50 PM »
She is connected through the Airport... and it's working fine... It just won't reconfigure... I can access my Airport Extreme and configure it wireless or wired, doesn't matter here.

And I could do that with my laptop wirelessly with that old Snow Airport as well. Go figure...

I think there may be a firmware issue between the MacBook and the old Snow Airport. I didn't try it with my daughter's new MacBook Pro, but she's not encountering any problems at all with the Airport Extreme anyway.

So, XABD, it's about a 5 hour drive. Probably about 15 hours for you, but if you meet me there, I'll buy the sushi...  wink2.gif

Krissel lives nearby, what a great idea GUNUG... I'm sure Kris will be all over that! harhar.gif

In the meantime, Mayo, I'll tell her to connect an ethernet cable and see if that solves the problem, definitely worth a try!

But I gotta tell you, she is incredibly computer and technology phobic, so it could get interesting...

Jennie, thanks as well.

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Offline krissel

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Old Snow Airport Not Recognized
« Reply #7 on: May 16, 2007, 11:42:56 PM »
Well Chris, I would be happy to help out your sister but I don't know much about Airport and Apple's setup utility. The only wireless I have ever used is with my Wallstreet and my D-Link router. I was offered an Airport by a TS member though.  Thinking.gif


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Offline gunug

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Old Snow Airport Not Recognized
« Reply #8 on: May 17, 2007, 02:25:29 AM »
Chris; this not resetting after being in place, and presumably untouched, is precisely what I was having to use the reset button to "cure" on this Airport Extreme.  I've also run into this kind of thing on a Linksys WRT54G with original software.  That one I think was being torqued with power and cable outages!  In neither case would the router respond to the password or anything without being reset.
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Offline chriskleeman

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Old Snow Airport Not Recognized
« Reply #9 on: May 17, 2007, 09:13:54 AM »
That's probably a good idea, gunug. Resetting might cure the non-recognition... I'm just trying to diagnose this long distance, and really, if she's online and it's working, I may not want to mess with it from here, because if someting fouls up, she might not have the patience to understand how to fix it.

And I want her to stop hijacking her neighbor's wireless!

 thanx.gif

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Offline Mayo

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Old Snow Airport Not Recognized
« Reply #10 on: May 17, 2007, 11:45:41 AM »
I missed that your sister is able to get online and that you only want to enable network encryption.  I think that the path of least resistance would be to let it go for now and configure it next time you visit, or hire a local Mac tech support person to configure the base station. Enabling network encryption doesn't always go smoothly and attempting to do it via long distance could cause more problems than it solves.

(Chris, the following isn't directed at your sis... it's just something that was brought-up for me by a comment you made in this thread...)

Personally, I am beginning to think that self-proclaimed computer-phobic people should not have a computer, period.  If they are truly happier without one, Bully For Them.  If they should find themselves missing out on the advantages of owning a computer, then they should be willing to learn the basics, or at the very least be willing to pay a Mac consultant to keep it up-and running. But the folks who don't want to take the time to learn how to operate and maintain their computer yet expect help from friends and family (often while complaining about computers, or saying "I don't have time to learn how this thing works") drive me nuts, and I have had my fill of it.

Life Is Too Short for me to waste my precious days dealing with such people, free of charge. I don't even want to deal with them for money...

Offline Paddy

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Old Snow Airport Not Recognized
« Reply #11 on: May 17, 2007, 02:20:49 PM »
For some it DOES seem like genuine willful stupidity or mental laziness - but for others, there is real fear of the unknown, anxiety when dealing with something they don't understand, fear of failure or incompetence. Those of us who've had computers as integral parts of our lives for the last 20 years have a hard time understanding how someone (like my 86-year-old Dad, for instance) doesn't quite understand how to use a mouse, for instance. For my children, not knowing how to use a mouse would be akin to not knowing how to talk - in fact I think both of them figured out the mouse before they talked in full sentences! Many of us in this forum straddle the age group that sort of grew up with computers - but could also have managed to avoid them or had little contact with them until more recently. Our children, and the younger members of the forum (Parker, Peter etc.) have never lived in a time without computers and other high-tech gadgets and probably cannot imagine their lives without them. And then there are those members of the senior set, who could easily have not had to interact significantly with computers at all during their working lives and perhaps only came to use them at home. My 72-year old aunt falls into that category. I think circumstances have a great deal to do with the attitude. My aunt does rely on me for tech help from time to time, but she does make an effort to remember what I tell her and rarely, if ever, comes back to me with the same problem twice. She's much more interested in her writing than the mechanics of her Mac, but I also know that she'd now be lost without it. Do I expect her to become a Mac guru? No. And yes - occasionally she'd hire someone to help her, when my being 500 miles away precluded hands-on help. I guess she's your "ideal" for someone who is somewhat technophobic, Mayo! But...we all excel at different things. My dad is terrific at fixing lawn mowers and all manner of small engines or anything mechanical (including cars, until they got so darn computerized!). He was always fixing things for other people - people who knew nothing about small engines or mechanical things, but perhaps knew a lot about something else. Did he expect the people who came to him for help to acquire all the knowledge that he had? No. Sure, sometimes he complained that if they'd only done such-and-such then they wouldn't have gotten themselves in such a mess etc., but he was generally willing to help.

I guess what I'm trying to say is that sometimes it's a community thing - being competent in one area, and helping others and in return, receiving help in other areas when you need it. Everyone cannot be an expert in everything. Of course, if someone keeps coming back time after time, making the same mistakes over and over or consistently forgetting instructions, and refusing to read the help pages, then perhaps it's time to say "you're on your own"....

Sometimes it's hard to remember to be patient - and to remember when we were that incompetent. However brief that period may have been for some of us, you can bet that it existed. For some people, throwing them in at the deep end works. That's what my husband did about 15 years ago, shortly after we got our first Mac - he got tired of bailing me out and told me to figure it out myself...and I did. (and now there are some things I know way more about than he does) But not everyone has the self-confidence to do that - or perhaps the true desire to do that. They're interested in using their computers - as tools, a means to an end - they don't find them endlessly fascinating or interesting in and of themselves.  

I do find it amusing though, that driving a car is a very complex task...but for some reason or other, not nearly as scary for many people as operating a computer, despite the fact that it's much more likely that an incompetent driver will cause serious or irreparable damage to the car, himself or others. Do you ever hear people say "I just don't have time to figure out how to do this..." or "I'm just car-phobic"? Not very often!!
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Offline Mayo

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Old Snow Airport Not Recognized
« Reply #12 on: May 17, 2007, 06:48:41 PM »
Paddy, there are variations on this theme, and I was referring to one particular type of person that you described as "someone (who) keeps coming back time after time, making the same mistakes over and over or consistently forgetting instructions, and refusing to read the help pages..." I would add to that "and who refuses to read a basic computer book (such as one of the "Missing Manual" guides) and waits until he/she is facing a deadline to try to use new software/hardware."

Again, I want to clarify that my previous post has absolutely nothing to do with Chris' sis, as I know nothing of her situation and it isn't really any of my business anyway.  So people needn't waste bandwidth defending her or attacking me!

I was merely "stimulated," so to speak, by two words in one of Chris' posts: "phobic" and "patience." And since I am currently working in both a paid and unpaid fashion training people and trouble-shooting their Macs, it kind of got me going in a general sense, as I wasn't trying to make a point regarding Chris' situation. It might have something to do with the fact I turned 53 on Monday and I have been dealing with a relatively rare but potentially very serious health problem the past year (doing MUCH better, thank you), so how I spend my remaining days has been on my mind a lot more than when I was a strapping lad of twenty...

The feedback (and referrals) that I have received from my friends/clients (the oldest in his 70s...) regarding my patience and avoidance of confusing jargon (while encouraging people to use the correct computer terminology as much as possible, particularly when dealing with telephone and e-mail tech support) leads me to believe that I am on the right track when working with people of different ages and technological comfort zones.

The people who drive me nuts are the ones who refuse to learn the basics because "I don't have the time," who won't use the Help function, who rely on tech support people and/or their friends to deal with the simplest of computer tasks, and then loudly complain about how computers are "taking over the world" and that everything was so much easier before personal computers. Whether this comes from an irrational fear of technology (phobia) or stubbornness is beside the point... Granted, this attitude seems to be more prevalent on the PC side, but I have run into it with some Mac users too.

The reality is that computers are not yet appliances, so they require more knowledge to operate and maintain properly. And some software seems to require the same amount of time to master as obtaining a PhD! But computer makers and stores downplay this side of things, if they mention it at all.  And more than a few folks are in serious denial about the reality of using a personal computer. When someone I know begins musing about getting their first computer, I try to let them know what I think is necessary to create the best possible experience without dampening their enthusiasm.  In a fewcases I have told someone that I think that they would be happier staying "analog."  

Heck, I resisted getting a computer as long as I could even though I have been around them since my high school days, when data was inputted with punch cards... I knew that they required time and energy to learn how to use (not to mention a lot of $$$), and I wanted to do other things and I could do what I wanted without a computer. But I finally bought a "word processor," and five years later in '95 I got an Apple Performa, an experience that was a total disaster due to my lack of preparation and hardware problems that were due to a known defect that I learned about after the fact. I got rid of the Performa after about three months, and then spent the next two years reading all the Mac magazines and a few books, beginning with... Wait For It... "Mac for Dummies."  

When I felt ready to try again, I hired a Mac consultant (I was going to use the Mac in my business so I couldn't mess around getting going) and upon his recommendation I bought a 7300/200 (some recommendation... two months later the Beige G3 was released!)  The consultant got my computer, two printers and a scanner up-and-running, something I could not have accomplished at the time.  I tried to get him to teach me the basics, but he seemed more interested in keeping me in the dark so that I would be dependent on him (at $40 an hour in 1997.) His lack of attention to personal hygiene and minimal social skills along with his cryptic answers to my questions spurred me on to become as self-sufficient as possible, computer-wise.   I did a LOT more reading, scoured online resources and I spent many hours at the computer making mistakes (nothing like this comes easy for me;I struggled with learning and physical disabilities as a child). Slowly but surely I got better at using the thing. Believe me, it was painful at times and I remember well how it is to be a beginner. But I rather enjoy being a beginner when I am interested in a subject; the learning process can be very exciting with the right teacher(s) and if you are really into it. I hope that I never stop being a "beginner." (On the other hand, at this time in my life I am enjoying having enough experience in several subjects to feel competent in what I do and to be making a good living utilizing the skills I have nurtured over the years.)

So It Goes. To summarize... in my little universe, if it isn't fun, I'm going to try to the best of my ability to avoid doing it. I suppose that is why I got going on this subject in the first place!

Offline jepinto

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Old Snow Airport Not Recognized
« Reply #13 on: May 17, 2007, 07:54:15 PM »
Chris-A really dumb shot in the dark here....but is she using the right Airport Admin Utility?  I was on a MPC today and noticed there is a separate utility for Snows...and something else.  I noticed the Snow because of this thread.

And they are both in applications/utilities/  one right above/below the other
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Offline Xairbusdriver

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Old Snow Airport Not Recognized
« Reply #14 on: May 17, 2007, 09:40:54 PM »
First, let me admit/explain that I am really an Airport novice. I almost checked at a Chicago Apple store on the layover on tehe way to Ireland to purchase a card for my wife's laptop. Seems that would have been an expensive purchase since there alreaydy was a card installed. wallbash.gif blush-anim-cl.gif

We didn't even buy a base station until last Christmas. It's worked like a champ the whole time, however.

QUOTE
EVERY wireless router I've dealt with has LARGE letters telling the user to not try resetting it via wireless.
That's news to me. And it may be that you're talking about a different type of "reset". But I finally found a cure for a problem I've complained about ever since we got the Airport; when it happens to shut down because of some idiot pulling the wrong power cord or the power goes out, it assigns new IP addresses to everything on the LAN. The solution was to simply assign the Macs the IP number I want and set "Configure IPv4:" to "Manually". Then the base station doesn't assign new numbers to anything ( except the laser printer and even that seems to be the next available number after the Macs clap.gif ). Problem solved.

Now, the above is relevant because, each time I made a change to the base station, it informed me that it was resetting itself and I could just sit and watch the blinking lights or go get some coffee, I was no longer needed. laugh.gif Maybe this is a different type of "reset". dntknw.gif But it's the only way I've done it. dntknw.gif But I don't remember reading anything about not doing this procedure in the 'manual' and it seems to be automatic when one makes changes via the Utility. There is no option to 'Cancel'.

So, if the user is using the correct utility and has even done a manual reset via the small, almost hidden button, and the station is still not 'visible' I can only assume that there is probably a hardware problem.

However, I now read that the station actually does work as a path to the internet, it is simply unable to be re-configured. I completely missed that info from the beginning. wallbash.gif blush-anim-cl.gif

So, will somebody kindly tell me what kind of resetting it is that one is told by every manufacturer ( except Apple, apparently ) not to do? And how do I keep Airport Admin Utility from doing that, if it ain't supposed to?! eek2.gif
« Last Edit: September 15, 2007, 10:12:27 PM by Xairbusdriver »
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