Author Topic: Gift "counsel", please  (Read 2698 times)

Offline RHPConsult

  • TS Addict
  • Posts: 7859
    • View Profile
    • http://
Gift "counsel", please
« on: October 23, 2009, 12:15:40 AM »
I want to help my brother-in-law (in Ohio) "decide" to switch from Windez '97 to Mac (@ age 80) by giving him one of the new Minis to use with his Dell monitor, the Dell computer having been fried a couple of weeks ago when lightning struck the Comcast pole on his rural property. Without some "help", I fear he'll slide back into Dell's embrace.

All he really does (but, enjoys a lot) is look at market reports, do e-messaging, + some word-processing – no music, no games, no iPhoto.

The new Mini which I saw at  the Apple Store yesterday appears beefed up from its early days. It would do the job, would it not, while transiting to Snow Leopard for a non-nerd should not be too difficult. Right?

And with an iSight camera, he should be able to have video chats for the first time with us, should he not?

Any Mini enthusiasts out there in TeeEssLand?

Offline Xairbusdriver

  • Administrator
  • TS Addict
  • *****
  • Posts: 26388
  • 27" iMac (mid-17), Big Sur, Mac mini, Catalina
    • View Profile
    • Mid-South Weather
Gift "counsel", please
« Reply #1 on: October 23, 2009, 08:35:14 AM »
A personal opinion here, but I don't think the hardware will really be the problem. Many long-time Windows users have various levels of difficulty transitioning to the Mac. It could well be that the longer they've used Windows, the harder it is. User experience levels are also a big factor, I suspect.

A 'geek' can probably switch with hardly any problems, they usually understand the mechanisms inherent in any computer. They understand that the GUI is just a way of communicating between humans and silicon. They can usually adapt to different methods easily. Swap "control" for "command" usually does most of the work with keyboard shortcuts. It may take a while to realize there is only one menu bar instead of one for every window. etcetera...

Casual users may be much more intimidated by these simple changes. And it may be impossible to ever learn that closing an apps windows does not Quit the program on a Mac! smile.gif Most programs that are duplicated on each platform have minor and sometimes major differences. Not only in appearance but in capabilities. Controls are often in different places, methods of doing the same thing are often quite different (usually easier on the Mac, but that is still a change that must be un-learned and re-learned.

While Mac users are confident that 'our' way is better/easier, we must remember that most of us have been doing this for a good deal of time. What is second nature to us can become extremely frustrating for a new comer. I suspect hat most of us would find it difficult, for varying amounts of time, to completely switch to Windows, even in Windows 7. wink.gif

Finally, I think you should expect a possibly long-term period of 'support.' Long distance telephonic 'hand-holding is seldom enjoyable and can become extremely difficult when new words for similar actions are involved. And then there are completely new words for completely new actions! eek2.gif "What is all this stuff with a little "i" in their name?" "Where is the File Explorer?" "Where is the Start button?" "Why are all those little picture things on the wrong side of the window?" "What do you mean by 'monitor,' why should I have to monitor anything?" "Why do I need an adaptor just to use my TV thingy?"

Perhaps I'm starting to exaggerate, but you probably get the picture. Perhaps Ed is very computer literate. I already know you are more patient than I am, of course, around 95% of the world fits [b[]that[/b] category! blush-anim-cl.gif

I am suggesting that it is sometimes better for a person to keep using a familiar system than to be offered a 'better' system that may bring many frustrations for possibly a long time. While you may be able to grasp new ideas and methods in the computing environment, most people simply want to do simple things in a way they have already learned. They may have no interest in even knowing that there may be easier ways of doing the same thing or even doing new things. But only you know the details in this matter and you will have to live with the consequences! Not only in direct support but in the sometimes very difficult 'family' interaction! I know that your brother-in-law has a fantastic home and acreage to visit, I certainly wouldn't want you to find those visits become less enjoyable! eek2.gif

"Good luck, young Will!" salute.gif Be sure to let us know if there is anything we can do to safely help, family counseling excepted, of course! scram.gif
THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF COUNTRIES
Those that use metric = #1 Measurement system
And the United States = The Banana system
CAUTION! Childhood vaccinations cause adults! :yes:

Offline jwboyd

  • Super Duper Poster
  • ****
  • Posts: 912
    • View Profile
    • http://
Gift "counsel", please
« Reply #2 on: October 23, 2009, 08:45:03 AM »
Dick

We would love to welcome Ed to Mac-Land and TeeEss.

But would you (and he) consider an iMac? With the Mini, you would have to add keyboard, mouse, and iSight camera, all of which are standard with the iMac. And right now Apple is offering an iMac refurb for only $849!

Best regards

Joe

========

Edit to add:

Jim's post got here before mine did. I do agree that the transition may be frustrating to both of you at first. But I am confident that two intelligent gentlemen can handle it with aplomb.

JB
« Last Edit: October 23, 2009, 08:52:39 AM by jwboyd »
I'm not a complete idiot -- a few parts are missing!

Offline RHPConsult

  • TS Addict
  • Posts: 7859
    • View Profile
    • http://
Gift "counsel", please
« Reply #3 on: October 23, 2009, 09:00:16 AM »
Very, very wise, ABD. Thank you. You know what a great guy he is, and why I want this to be easy – or not at all!

Given that he never really "pushed" Windows, IMHO, he probably doesn't even know where the "hood latch" is, let alone what's under it. So, as you allude, learning the controls "on the dash" may be the primary hurdle.

Your ideas suggest the wisdom of having our (shared) grand nephew (MY First Switcher – and a powerfully committed one, to boot – who's a retired avionics lead of a major airline) reflect on these issues you present and add any of his own he thinks will effect a smooth transition.

It would be interesting to hear from any other TeeEssers who've "managed" any process similar to this.

Our "subject" is a list maker. I've already started one.

Do I recall correctly that O'Reilly has a small handbook for switchers? Pogue would be too intimidating, IMO, for starters.

Offline RHPConsult

  • TS Addict
  • Posts: 7859
    • View Profile
    • http://
Gift "counsel", please
« Reply #4 on: October 23, 2009, 09:05:49 AM »
Joe:

I'm prophesying that if he continues to use his Dell Monitor, and the iSight camera my daughter will no longer need (given the "retirement" of her Igloo) then the Mini will be seen as less intimidating.

Plus, candidly I think he'll object less to a gift of a Mini than he would of an iMac. That's a potential problem, lying in the background.

(Think: chess game, here, folks. Gptta know where all the pieces are, all the time)

The refurb IS a splendid possibility. as I recall folks hereabouts have had good experience with them.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2009, 09:09:36 AM by RHPConsult »

Offline Xairbusdriver

  • Administrator
  • TS Addict
  • *****
  • Posts: 26388
  • 27" iMac (mid-17), Big Sur, Mac mini, Catalina
    • View Profile
    • Mid-South Weather
Gift "counsel", please
« Reply #5 on: October 23, 2009, 09:24:32 AM »
Have you ever received a 'gift' and not known how to 'thank' the giver? blush-anim-cl.gif "Why yes! I love fruit cake! (and I'm sure the person I give it to will will, also!)" "Thanks so much, dad, for the 10-year old VW. It will be fun learning how to repair it! I really don't need that little red convertible I told you about, anyway." laughhard.gif I'm jist sayin'... wink.gif
THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF COUNTRIES
Those that use metric = #1 Measurement system
And the United States = The Banana system
CAUTION! Childhood vaccinations cause adults! :yes:

Offline daryl66

  • TS Addict
  • *****
  • Posts: 1047
    • View Profile
Gift "counsel", please
« Reply #6 on: October 23, 2009, 01:27:20 PM »
QUOTE(RHPConsult @ Oct 23 2009, 12:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>
And with an iSight camera, he should be able to have video chats for the first time with us, should he not?

Any Mini enthusiasts out there in TeeEssLand?

Don't know if I qualify as and "enthusiast" but I have been using a Mini (1.83 2 Duo,1GB and now 10.5.8)connected to a 19" Acer lcd, for almost a year now, since I could not get his "Steveness" to replace my broken (4th time) G5 Imac. I absolutely love it. It is used for all the normal things (normal for me) web, email, Word,Excel,Powerpoint,iWeb,iPhoto,Photoshop,Printshop. etc .  I have not found anything It could NOT do. The only thing I would like to have and do not is the "superdrive" so I cannot burn DVD's. (only wanted to do that once).  I have considered adding an iSight camera for iChat but it has not come to the top of the list. It networks nicely. I found it on Apple's refurb store($415) but have not seen one on their since.

Much as I would love to have one of the new Imacs, justifying it is hard.

Highly recommended.
HTH

Daryl toothgrin.gif
2019 27" iMac OSX 14.4 2011 MBP OSX 10.13.6, 2017 MBAir OSX 12.7.4, iPad IOS 17.4.1, iPhone13 IOS 17.4.1, iPhone SE IOS 17.4.1, Watch 9, M2 MBA OSX 14.4

Offline RHPConsult

  • TS Addict
  • Posts: 7859
    • View Profile
    • http://
Gift "counsel", please
« Reply #7 on: October 23, 2009, 06:25:04 PM »
Spent some time this p.m. at the Apple Store, playing around with the new 27+" iMac. WhooHoo!

Tried to send this assemblage a posting from the store, but some room-temperature dude I had never seen there since it opened, came to "my" station, grabbed my mouse, without comment, called up some unknown sw, and blocked me w/o so much of a fare thee well. Two of my favorite Geniuses saw me enter the store, came over to chat, but stood aside for "his eminence" (to whom I have yet to be introduced) looking, frankly, embarrassed at the discourtesies I was receiving.

IF I decide to take my immediate business elsewhere, I will take considerable pains to . . .
  • Suitably inform the Chairman of the Corporation
  • Inform Apple's VP of Retail/Sales/Merchandising/whatever
  • Informing the Burlingame Store's management

You can be sure of it.

Call it . . . "shareholder shooting self in foot" . . . but I will NOT let that arrogant clown get away with this outrage unscathed.
« Last Edit: October 23, 2009, 08:57:40 PM by RHPConsult »

Offline Xairbusdriver

  • Administrator
  • TS Addict
  • *****
  • Posts: 26388
  • 27" iMac (mid-17), Big Sur, Mac mini, Catalina
    • View Profile
    • Mid-South Weather
Gift "counsel", please
« Reply #8 on: October 23, 2009, 08:06:43 PM »
"Heaven has no rage like love to hatred turned
Nor hell a fury like a [shareholder] scorned."

eek2.gif
« Last Edit: October 23, 2009, 08:07:25 PM by Xairbusdriver »
THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF COUNTRIES
Those that use metric = #1 Measurement system
And the United States = The Banana system
CAUTION! Childhood vaccinations cause adults! :yes:

Offline eric j

  • Super Poster
  • ***
  • Posts: 345
    • View Profile
    • http://
Gift "counsel", please
« Reply #9 on: October 23, 2009, 08:34:12 PM »
Hi,

Some time ago I sought recommendations about replacing an old eMac for my wife (No, I don't mean "exchange" an eMac for my wife). She was accustomed to the Mac GUI etc but in no way computer literate. I also asked about a webcam.

Forget now who put me on the track to a Mini (I'm also approaching 81) but it has proved to be the perfect solution for her. She uses the Mini for Internet browsing and Skype. Coupled with an inexpensive McAlly "Icecam2" webcam and an low-priced monitor the Mini has proved to be the perfect solution.

At least I know that it was Sandbox who asked me to let others know about our experience with the McAlly. To be honest its imaging is less good than the "iSight" that I saw on demo in our local dealer but ambient light may play a significant role in this regard. Fact remains, my beloved is happy with it.

FWIW

eric j
« Last Edit: October 23, 2009, 08:38:39 PM by eric j »

Offline RHPConsult

  • TS Addict
  • Posts: 7859
    • View Profile
    • http://
Gift "counsel", please
« Reply #10 on: October 23, 2009, 09:04:42 PM »
Thanks to all for experiences with the Mini. VERY informative.
• • • • •

Note to ABD:
You got that right!  
30+ years of experience providing counsel to CEOs demonstrates clearly to me that they are always interested finding out what's really going on!

Offline sandbox

  • TS Addict
  • *****
  • Posts: 7825
    • View Profile
    • http://
Gift "counsel", please
« Reply #11 on: October 24, 2009, 03:25:40 AM »
FYI,
I run a MiNi on snow leopard with an iSight Camera, mounted atop a 24" Samsung Monitor/TV with a Logitech Keyboard and mouse. Connected to a Netgear N router, two 5-in-1 printers. A USB 2 hub and a Firewire 800 hub with one hard drive for time machine and two chained hard drives for backup.

All'swell so far...