Backing up/Need another External HD

[prin]

Hello All,
I sincerely, truly hope I'm in the correct place. I consider all of this a tech problem, but am not 100% on that. I haven't been here for too long so basically I have forgotten almost everything I knew. I reviewed Topics and such - I never knew that anything written on this site can be accessed by the world. Wow. Ok, so first I tried to figure out how to do a screen shot, which I knew how to do once upon a time. I followed the directions given, but nope. Can't do it. So I'm going to copy/paste below what this machine is. Here are my issues:
1. Vertical very thin lines running down screen. I did say this is a very old iImac so hubby and I want to get a newer one (I bought this from original user in 2010).
2. Memory is on overload.
3. LaCie was my external HD but I filled that a few years ago. I checked it a few weeks ago and it has 0 space on it.
4. Now I'm thinking that before even attempting to shop for an iMac or perhaps a Macbook laptop for hubby, I really need to back up this iMac because it has older but highly important work-related files on it.

I cannot think or see clearly (two auto accidents with related PTSD, anxiety, chronic pain, vision problems) so I thought I'd reach out to you. I don't know what to buy to back up this iMac. Please help. I'll discuss my MacBook Pro in a separate message, but this iMac issue comes first. I need to rest a bit now but I'll get back on later, either on this iMac or on my laptop. Btw, I do best if you send me a list of questions/problems/issues/whathaveyous.

Am thanking you in advance for courage, advice and ideas.

Here is the iMac info:
iMac Info 01/26/17

iMac  10.6.8 OS Sierra
Processor 1.83 GHz Intel Core Duo   

Memory 2 GB 667 MHz DDR2 SDRAM

Power On Self-Test:
  Last Run:   1/26/17 5:03 PM
  Result:   Passed

Memory Slots:
    ECC:   Disabled

BANK 0/DIMM0:

  Size:   1 GB
  Type:   DDR2 SDRAM
  Speed:   667 MHz
  Status:   OK
  Manufacturer:   0x2C00000000000000
  Part Number:   0x3848544631323836344844592D3636374531
  Serial Number:   0xDE15CC9D

BANK 1/DIMM1:

  Size:   1 GB
  Type:   DDR2 SDRAM
  Speed:   667 MHz
  Status:   OK
  Manufacturer:   0x2C00000000000000
  Part Number:   0x3848544631323836344844592D3636374531
  Serial Number:   0xDA204052

Hardware Overview:

  Model Name:   iMac
  Model Identifier:   iMac4,1
  Processor Name:   Intel Core Duo
  Processor Speed:   1.83 GHz
  Number Of Processors:   1
  Total Number Of Cores:   2
  L2 Cache:   2 MB
  Memory:   2 GB
  Bus Speed:   667 MHz
  Boot ROM Version:   IM41.0055.B08
  SMC Version (system):   1.1f5

[jchuzi]

Your iMac is officially considered obsolete by Apple, meaning that they will no longer provide parts or service. And, you are not running Sierra. OS 10.6.8 is not only Snow Leopard, but is the maximum OS that that machine can handle. The vertical, thin lines imply that the display is shot and Apple won't repair it. You have USB and Firewire connections, neither of which is extremely fast (judging from the specs in MacTracker, it's USB 2 and FW 400). If you get an external drive, be sure that it can use those connections. Later versions of USB and FW are backwards compatible (although you'll need a FW 400 - 800 adapter if the external has FW 800) but you'll only get the slower speeds of USB 2 and/or FW 400.

Apple will not help you with this but I suggest that you speak with a tech person at Other World Computing. This is a very reliable company (I have done business with them for many years so I speak from experience). OWC should be able to advise you about meeting your needs.

As long as you have the cash, a new computer is a great idea. If there is an Apple store near to you, you should go there and try the different models to see what suits you. You don't have to buy from Apple. Often, you can get better deals from BH photovideo, also a very reliable company. Look at http://appleinsider.com for a guide to deals.

What do you intend to do with the new computer? That determines which model to consider. More RAM is always a good thing as is more hard drive space. I know that you will be amazed at the difference in performance between your old iMac (which is one of the first to appear after the G5 iMacs were discontinued) and a new one.

Post back with any questions, and good luck to you!  

[Xairbusdriver]

Snow Leopard is a fine operating system... for its day. Unfortunately, as Jon pointed out, it is no longer supported by Apple. However, whatever comes on the next machine will be newer but not as different that you'll be confused. No need to worry about learning a new user interface.

QUOTE

Later versions of USB and FW are backwards compatible (although you'll need a FW 400 - 800 adapter if the external has FW 800) but you'll only get the slower speeds of USB 2 and/or FW 400.

I just want to add that when Jon says "you'll only get the slower speeds of USB 2 and/or FW 400" he means when you use those technologies on the old iMac. You will be able to use the newer, higher speeds when you connect them to the new(er) machine. On the other hand, the newest machines don't even have any flavor of FireWire (it's been replaced by Thunderbolt), so I'd suggest you consider USB 3, which is also compatible with all previous USB types, for the external drives.

Don't be rushed, but get all the info you need. Let us and any Apple techs retailers help. Would be wise to run any retailer suggestions by the folks here, they will, of course, be most happy to suggest the most expensive package.

Hope your new computer will make your life a bit more calm and yet interesting!

[prin]

QUOTE(jchuzi @ Mar 15 2017, 06:39 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Your iMac is officially considered obsolete by Apple, meaning that they will no longer provide parts or service. And, you are not running Sierra. OS 10.6.8 is not only Snow Leopard, but is the maximum OS that that machine can handle. The vertical, thin lines imply that the display is shot and Apple won't repair it. You have USB and Firewire connections, neither of which is extremely fast (judging from the specs in MacTracker, it's USB 2 and FW 400). If you get an external drive, be sure that it can use those connections. Later versions of USB and FW are backwards compatible (although you'll need a FW 400 - 800 adapter if the external has FW 800) but you'll only get the slower speeds of USB 2 and/or FW 400.

Apple will not help you with this but I suggest that you speak with a tech person at Other World Computing. This is a very reliable company (I have done business with them for many years so I speak from experience). OWC should be able to advise you about meeting your needs.

As long as you have the cash, a new computer is a great idea. If there is an Apple store near to you, you should go there and try the different models to see what suits you. You don't have to buy from Apple. Often, you can get better deals from BH photovideo, also a very reliable company. Look at http://appleinsider.com for a guide to deals.

What do you intend to do with the new computer? That determines which model to consider. More RAM is always a good thing as is more hard drive space. I know that you will be amazed at the difference in performance between your old iMac (which is one of the first to appear after the G5 iMacs were discontinued) and a new one.

Post back with any questions, and good luck to you!  

Hello Jon,
Well, it's been a bit more than a year since March 2017, and I'm still where I was with our ancient iMac, but I've had two surgeries plus medical issues that basically have kept me from accomplishing almost anything. I wanted to thank you most thoroughly for your kind reply last year. Confession: I didn't fully understand all of your reply regarding the sentences I tried to underline. I'm a bit lost. I thought I was supposed to find an external HD that has both USB 2 and USB 3 ports. No? Yes?
I will follow up with the company you recommended. In a related matter, you ask what I plan to do with a new computer. Graphics, writing, publications are all in my plans, which is why I desperately need a new external HD because I have loads of invaluable work on the old iMac. Do you still think my plan for a new iMac is the way to go? I want more RAM and definitely more HD space. Again, many thanks for your help, advice, and patience.

Kind regards,
Marti

[prin]

QUOTE(Xairbusdriver @ Mar 15 2017, 09:47 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Snow Leopard is a fine operating system... for its day. Unfortunately, as Jon pointed out, it is no longer supported by Apple. However, whatever comes on the next machine will be newer but not as different that you'll be confused. No need to worry about learning a new user interface.

QUOTE

Later versions of USB and FW are backwards compatible (although you'll need a FW 400 - 800 adapter if the external has FW 800) but you'll only get the slower speeds of USB 2 and/or FW 400.

I just want to add that when Jon says "you'll only get the slower speeds of USB 2 and/or FW 400" he means when you use those technologies on the old iMac. You will be able to use the newer, higher speeds when you connect them to the new(er) machine. On the other hand, the newest machines don't even have any flavor of FireWire (it's been replaced by Thunderbolt), so I'd suggest you consider USB 3, which is also compatible with all previous USB types, for the external drives.

Don't be rushed, but get all the info you need. Let us and any Apple techs retailers help. Would be wise to run any retailer suggestions by the folks here, they will, of course, be most happy to suggest the most expensive package.

Hope your new computer will make your life a bit more calm and yet interesting!

Dear Xairbusdriver,
THANK YOU for making my life easier. I think you anticipated some questions I would have. Your reply is tremendously helpful. And yes, it has been a bit more than a year since we communicated. Sometimes life gets in the way of computing. Am smiling at your note "Don't be rushed". I certainly took that seriously. smiles Now, I MUST act immediately to find the right external HD for my ancient iMac so I can back it up and move forward in buying a new iMac. Another clueless question on my part. After I back up the old iMac, can I upload all that info to a new iMac so I have my work files in one place?

I am so grateful to you.

Kind regards,
Marti

[jchuzi]

If you get an external drive, be sure that it can use those connections. Later versions of USB and FW are backwards compatible (although you'll need a FW 400 - 800 adapter if the external has FW 800) but you'll only get the slower speeds of USB 2 and/or FW 400.

This means that, if the external drive has (for example) USB 3 and your computer only has USB 2, it will still work but you won't get USB 3 speeds, only USB 2. The cable will fit, but the computer has a chip for USB 2, so that's the limiting factor. Similarly, if the external has Firewire 800 but the computer has a FW 400 chip, you'll only get FW 400 speeds (and you'll need an adapter for the cable).

Good luck with your health issues! I wish you only the best.

[Xairbusdriver]

First, take care of yourself and let others help you with that, as well!

Second, based on the "Model Identifier: iMac4,1", I think you have either a 17 or 21", models from around 2008. It is one of the first Intel based iMacs. If so, you have three USB 2.0 ports, two Firewire 400 ports and built-in AirPort Extreme (802.11g). Instead of buying cables to use maybe twice, just think about getting the external that will be best for the new iMac.

I think you have one of these two: iMac 17" or iMac 20"

Assuming you still have the MBP listed in your Profile, I'd suggest you bite the bullet and buy an Airport Extreme buy a WiFi router*. That will let you use the laptop anywhere in the house and connect to them both from either one. It will also allow you to access the old Mac before you shut it down for the last time.

You will probably want to use Migration Assistant to transfer everything on the old iMac to the new one, no external drive needed. Be aware, however, many of your applications will probably be out-of-date and some may not work. You can update them when you get time and already have all your files on the new iMac. The updated apps may cost and it may be time to start working with the new versions of apps supplied by Apple or free apps that can replace old ones that are no longer being supported. That's all work for the future, however.

I'm pretty sure any new iMac you buy will have at least 4GB of ram, possibly 8. Unless you added memory to the old one, it may have only 512MB! That's one half a Gigabyte! You will be getting at least 8 times that, maybe 16! I don't think you'll need any extra ram based on your plans.

Likewise, I think your internal drive is no more than 250MB! Most new iMacs come with 1 Terrabyte! Way more than what you now have! Again, I don;t thing you need to worry about getting all your files onto the new iMac.

I'd suggest you decide what iMac you want and we'll be able to figure out the easiest, simplest and hopefully least expensive way to transfer stuff from the old one.

* We've suspected the news was coming, but Apple today announced it has 'officially' stopped new Airport offerings. Here's some info at TidBITS with links to info on suggested replacements (assuming you don't already have a cable box with built-in WiFi).

[prin]

QUOTE(jchuzi @ Apr 26 2018, 03:40 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

If you get an external drive, be sure that it can use those connections. Later versions of USB and FW are backwards compatible (although you'll need a FW 400 - 800 adapter if the external has FW 800) but you'll only get the slower speeds of USB 2 and/or FW 400.

This means that, if the external drive has (for example) USB 3 and your computer only has USB 2, it will still work but you won't get USB 3 speeds, only USB 2. The cable will fit, but the computer has a chip for USB 2, so that's the limiting factor. Similarly, if the external has Firewire 800 but the computer has a FW 400 chip, you'll only get FW 400 speeds (and you'll need an adapter for the cable).

Good luck with your health issues! I wish you only the best.

Jon,
Much appreciation for your good wishes about my health problems. Heavens, I wish I would heal.
Thank you especially for the USB 3 info. PLEASE excuse my lack of knowledge - I used to understand more. When you refer to cable and an adapter, are you referring to the cable that connects to both computers and the ext hd? One more Q (I think) - I thought new iMacs don't have FW but Thunderbolt instead. No? So if that is the case, will an ext hd with USB 3 and FW work with a new iMac with Thunderbolt? I believe I have seriously misunderstood and confused USBs, FWs, and maybe even more. My computer life used to be simpler.   I realize this is a negative self message to formerly bright me, but I am feeling almost unbearably stupid. If you can, please hang in with me till this is resolved. There will be a celebration.

[prin]

QUOTE(Xairbusdriver @ Apr 26 2018, 04:15 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

First, take care of yourself and let others help you with that, as well!

Second, based on the "Model Identifier: iMac4,1", I think you have either a 17 or 21", models from around 2008. It is one of the first Intel based iMacs. If so, you have three USB 2.0 ports, two Firewire 400 ports and built-in AirPort Extreme (802.11g). Instead of buying cables to use maybe twice, just think about getting the external that will be best for the new iMac.

I think you have one of these two: iMac 17" or iMac 20"

Assuming you still have the MBP listed in your Profile, I'd suggest you bite the bullet and buy an Airport Extreme buy a WiFi router*. That will let you use the laptop anywhere in the house and connect to them both from either one. It will also allow you to access the old Mac before you shut it down for the last time.

You will probably want to use Migration Assistant to transfer everything on the old iMac to the new one, no external drive needed. Be aware, however, many of your applications will probably be out-of-date and some may not work. You can update them when you get time and already have all your files on the new iMac. The updated apps may cost and it may be time to start working with the new versions of apps supplied by Apple or free apps that can replace old ones that are no longer being supported. That's all work for the future, however.

I'm pretty sure any new iMac you buy will have at least 4GB of ram, possibly 8. Unless you added memory to the old one, it may have only 512MB! That's one half a Gigabyte! You will be getting at least 8 times that, maybe 16! I don't think you'll need any extra ram based on your plans.

Likewise, I think your internal drive is no more than 250MB! Most new iMacs come with 1 Terrabyte! Way more than what you now have! Again, I don;t thing you need to worry about getting all your files onto the new iMac.

I'd suggest you decide what iMac you want and we'll be able to figure out the easiest, simplest and hopefully least expensive way to transfer stuff from the old one.

* We've suspected the news was coming, but Apple today announced it has 'officially' stopped new Airport offerings. Here's some info at TidBITS with links to info on suggested replacements (assuming you don't already have a cable box with built-in WiFi).

Hi and thank you, Xairbusdriver,
Yes, I still have the MBP that is listed. Also, I neglected to change the Netopia DSL to my Wifi on external Cable box. I also have Airport Extreme. I hope I’m using all the correct language. We have a 3-level home and so far Wifi works fine. What I’ve been doing is using remote access from the MBP (3rd level of home) down 2 flights to the iMac. Or I just walk downstairs (good exercise) to old iMac to obtain a file or photos. I plan to buy an iMac with significant TBs.

Here is my jawdrop du jour. When you said I could “transfer from old to new iMac with no ext hd needed using Migration Assistant” (which I’ve never used - is it truly that simple & easy?), don’t I first still need to download all from iMac to an ext hd to transfer all to new iMac? I re-read - you said no, correct? How do the two iMacs communicate then for complete transfer? I will be so dazzled if your answer is “Yes, just go buy a new iMac, tell us what you bought and we will tell you how to use Migration Assistant”.

I believe I have understood the rest of your message. Least expensive sounds promising. Also, thank you for the Tidbits info.

Very best of everything to Jon and you for saving my sanity.  

[Xairbusdriver]

First some basic definitions.
USB stands for Universal Serial Buss. It is not a networking system. It is simply for connecting a device to (usually) a computer. It is not for connecting two computers or even a 'chain' of devices, one after another. You connect each device using one cable to the computer. If you have two devices, you need two cables. However, you can use a 'hub' to allow connecting several different kinds of devices to the computer. However, that generally means only one drive, in my experience. In any case, you will still need one cable for each device. Actually, about the only device that will have more than a single USB port, is a hub.

FireWire, Thunderbolt, Ethernet, WiFi are all networking systems. Many devices can be connected to many computers. Often, a device will have two (or more) ports. This allows 'daisy-chaining' several devices with just one connection to one computer, no 'hub' required.

Your new Mac will have Thunderbolt ports, but it will also have USB ports. Probably 2 of the former and 4 of the latter. Therefore, you can connect any USB device into the USB port. But if that device is the old USB 2 type, you will get only the USB 2 speed, even though the new Mac has USB 3 ports. That's why the concern about getting the fastest, newest types of connections on any new device (hard drive, etc.) that you buy. That's why I suggested not to buy a USB 2 drive since you will only get that slower speed when you connect to the new Mac.

Fortunately, if you buy a USB 3 capable drive, you can still connect it to the old Mac. That's what is meant by "backwards compatible". The newer device will adapt to the older, but not the other way.

Thunderbolt is faster than USB 3 and much more flexible, since it is actually a network system. Unfortunately, it is massively more expensive for mere consumers like us.

The simplest and least expensive way to connect the two Macs is a short, cheap Ethernet cable which both Macs already have.

I hope I haven't confused you!

[jchuzi]

QUOTE(Xairbusdriver @ Apr 27 2018, 08:30 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The simplest and least expensive way to connect the two Macs is a short, cheap Ethernet cable which both Macs already have.

I have tried this twice and couldn't get it to work. Here's what I had to do to migrate from my old Mac Pro to my (then) new iMac:

1. The Mac Pro had Firewire but the iMac didn't (and, to answer a previous question, none of the new Macs have Firewire). So, I bought a Firewire-Thunderbolt adapter (it's a short cable available from Apple). I plugged my Firewire 800 cable into the Mac Pro, plugged the adapter into the other end of the cable, and then plugged the Thunderbolt end of the adapter into the iMac. (If you have Firewire 400 on the old Mac, you can get a 400-800 adapter and use that to connect the 800 end to the other adapter.)

2. I started the Mac Pro into Target Disk Mode by pressing and holding T after the startup chime. When a Firewire icon appeared on the screen, I released the key.

3. I then started the iMac (and you should not start your new computer until this step). Migration Assistant (it may be called Setup Assistant, but no matter) appeared on the iMac screen. I followed the prompts to migrate everything from the Mac Pro. For me, the process took about 45 minutes but your mileage will vary. At the end, everything was in place on the iMac. You should eject the Firewire icon that you'll see on the desktop (this unmounts the old computer safely). At this point, you can turn off the old computer by pressing and holding its power button.

I had to reset some preferences, but that's normal. I suggest that the first thing you do is open System Preferences and tweak all of them to your liking.

Before you start, you should read How to move your content to a new Mac. Good luck with your new project!

[Xairbusdriver]

That is another way. The point is, you have several methods that will work. Your main concern should be deciding on which new Mac you want. The rest can and has been done.