Those pesky external drives

[kimmer]

I have several external drives, 3 of which are always plugged in to power and mounted on my iMac. My iMac runs 24/7, although it goes to sleep on it's own.

A couple of days ago my main CCC drive went belly up (Seagate and 2 years old). I could see the drive in the finder side panel (is that the right name?), and I could actually open it in the finder and I was able to drag items from the drive to my desktop, but neither Disk Utility nor DiskWarrior were able to repair/recover the drive--both said the disk was in use. I quit every program, I rebooted in safe mode. I researched. Finally after several hours I opted to replace the drive and discovered I couldn't unmount the drive without force ejecting--which I did. The drive is still sitting here on my desk, as I haven't yet decided what to do--but I'll probably use my new drilling skills and destroy it. 

I was thankful that I always have a spare, brand new, backup drive on the shelf and was able to plug that in and use it. I did run into an alert about how I might not be able to boot from the drive if I formatted it in Mac OS Extended (Journaled), but research showed me this was the proper way to format, so that's what I did. If I'm in wrong, please let me know and I'll reformat and redo.

Okay, so now today ... I log in to my iMac and am faced with an alert from TimeMachine that it couldn't back up to its external drive (also Seagate but only 4 months old). Same story as the CCC drive, and now I hold my breath for those new externals to arrive tomorrow.

So here's my big question: these drive are from the same maker (and it's the drive that Paddy always recommends and I've used in the past and never had these type of problems), but not the same age, and neither drive gave me any alerts or issues prior to suddenly going belly up. However they both use the same USB hub. Could it be the USB hub? Could it be the power strip (designed to take a power surge)? Could it be (HORRORS!) my iMac? The other common electrical thing is they are on the same circuit, but I've checked and I'm not overloading the circuit.

I've eliminated any other type of whole house electrical problem, so I'm down to these peripherals. Which one might be the likely suspect? If I replace, what do you recommend replacing them with? Also should I consider different external drives? If so, which one(s)?

HELP, please.

[jchuzi]

I have no idea if this will help, but when I boot from a CCC drive and try to run Disk Warrior on my internal, I get the message that the drive is in use and cannot be unmounted. I found that the culprit is Adobe's Core Sync (whatever that is), which I can quit via Activity Monitor. When I do that, I can unmount the drive and run DW. I believe that Core Sync is part of Adobe Creative Cloud, because I never had this issue before I subscribed to it.

Worth a thought...

[Xairbusdriver]

it's the drive that Paddy always recommends

Well, there's your problem!

'..could see the drive in the Finder' Sidebar.

1. 'both said the disk was in use' It probably was, you probably still had it selected in Finder, displaying its contents. Sometimes, I've had Finder get confused and rather 'protective' of any Device it sees. When that happens, it won't eject the device and other apps, especially those that want to unmount a drive, can't and throw up that alert. Usually, a simple Restart clears that problem. It might even work by Restarting Finder. So...

Did you try Disk Utility (with only minor capabilities) or DW after a Restart/Cold Start?

[/b]DW will basically rebuilds the drive's directory, but if you can see the files/folders AND download/transfer them to the internal (or anywhere else) AND open them in whatever app created them, I'd say the directory is probably OK.

2. [The drives] 'use the same USB hub.' Is that a powered hub? One that has it's own AC plug.

3. The iMac "goes to sleep". Is it the screen or the drive or both that are 'sleeping'? Remember, TM will try to make a backup every hour, if it can't see the internal drive because it is asleep, it may send that 'can't make a backup' alert (which doesn't really offer reason). What does your Energy Saver System Prefs look like?

4. 'the power strip (designed to take a power surge)' The inexpensive ones usually use sacrificial chips to prevent the surge from getting into the attached devices. More expensive ones can take a 'hit' and reset. Like drives in a third-party enclosure, you may not know what's actually inside. Lightening is the most common cause of surges, but other causes can also cause them. I don't know of a user-friendly way to test them for efficacy.

Bottom line, don't 'modify' your externals for better 'cooling' just yet. One thing at a time, please. And don't panic... yet!

[kimmer]

I have no idea if this will help, but when I boot from a CCC drive and try to run Disk Warrior on my internal, I get the message that the drive is in use and cannot be unmounted. I found that the culprit is Adobe's Core Sync (whatever that is), which I can quit via Activity Monitor. When I do that, I can unmount the drive and run DW. I believe that Core Sync is part of Adobe Creative Cloud, because I never had this issue before I subscribed to it.

Worth a thought...

Thanks. I don't have Adobe Creative Cloud, but I launched AM to be sure and I don't have Core Sync running.

Also, I didn't boot from the external as it refused. Good thought, though.

[kimmer]

1. Did you try Disk Utility (with only minor capabilities) or DW after a Restart/Cold Start?

Yes.

2. [The drives] 'use the same USB hub.' Is that a powered hub? One that has it's own AC plug.

No not powered, runs from my iMac.

3. The iMac "goes to sleep". Is it the screen or the drive or both that are 'sleeping'? Remember, TM will try to make a backup every hour, if it can't see the internal drive because it is asleep, it may send that 'can't make a backup' alert (which doesn't really offer reason). What does your Energy Saver System Prefs look like?

Hmm. Not sure this matters as once I woke up the iMac and was using it, I still received the same error message; but a screen cap is below.

4. 'the power strip (designed to take a power surge)' The inexpensive ones usually use sacrificial chips to prevent the surge from getting into the attached devices. More expensive ones can take a 'hit' and reset. Like drives in a third-party enclosure, you may not know what's actually inside. Lightening is the most common cause of surges, but other causes can also cause them. I don't know of a user-friendly way to test them for efficacy.

The iMac is plugged into one of those battery backup expensive things (think it's APC, but I'd have to get a flashlight to actually read the name), and that is only a year or less old--don't remember the exact date I purchased it.

Bottom line, don't 'modify' your externals for better 'cooling' just yet. One thing at a time, please. And don't panic... yet!

No panic, but I am concerned as I also have the backup drive for Sneakers computer attached and until the new backups arrive, I can't back it up short of filling up the HD on my iMac. I am going to pull some of the files to my iMac just in case. I'll open another thread in a few days on how to deal with this drive as it's complicated, and as you say one thing at a time.

[kimmer]

I just had a whopping finder crash.    So I opted to do another restart and suddenly all is well and TM is working. Go figure. I'm still going to add the extra TM external when they arrive tomorrow. In a bit, I'm going to plug this former CCC drive in and see if it shows up and works. If so, I'll erase it and start it fresh for a 2 CCC backup.

I'll also dup Sneakers backup. I think I'll do it the hard way and go through folder by folder and only back up what I care about. I really don't need all his now very old applications and such. Plus it's in 3 partitions (matched his HD), and I only want one backup.

Go figure. Actually I can't. No clue what's going on. Please don't tell me I need a new iMac. 

[jchuzi]

A restart fixed it? That's probably the issue. You leave your mac running 24/7 and restarting can get rid of a lot of detritus. You should restart once in awhile. As an analogy, I take a shower every 6 months whether or not I need it.   

[kimmer]

A restart fixed it? That's probably the issue. You leave your mac running 24/7 and restarting can get rid of a lot of detritus. You should restart once in awhile. As an analogy, I take a shower every 6 months whether or not I need it.   

I do restart now and then; and I had tried a restart to fix this issue. I have no clue what was going on. The whole shower thing ... Ewwwwww.

[Xairbusdriver]

Not sure why you run the Mac 24/7/365. Are you running an app that records data 24/7? Even in that case, you can set up Energy Saver to shut down at midnight and then startup at 12:05am. You might lose five minutes of data collection but you’ll gain the daily cleaning of memory leaks that are almost alway lurking... 

My iMac shuts down around 10:30pm and starts up before I do!

I do run my Mac mini 24/7, but it is only running one major app and with so many System updates requiring restarts I am likely to get 45 days of continuous operation. And then the lightening hits to the local power system, two weeks can be nice!

[kimmer]

Not sure why you run the Mac 24/7/365.

Because I want to do so.   You get to do things your way, I get to do them my way.

[Xairbusdriver]

I have no problem with "doing things [your] way". However, it is important to be aware of the consequences of our choices. I do not agree with jon's shower routine. I think every four weeks is much more reasonable and easier to remember.

BTW, does your APC have an outlet that your iMac can control? Mine has one that includes two or three 'sub' outlets that cut power when the iMac is shutdown.

I really do recommend using a AC powered hub (of any type). If more than one device happens to be 'sucking' power from only one port on the Mac, it can affect their performance. USB, especially, is not a good power or data  manager compared to even things like Ethernet. The super fast CPUs now in use seem to help in the data management, but the power splitting method can still be problematic with mechanical drives. Just a suggestion, of course. You can always do thing the incorrect way instead of my way...

[kimmer]

Just curious if there's any particular powered USB (has its own AC plug vs using power from iMac) hub anyone recommends?

[jchuzi]

I have this Tripplite USB 3 hub and it works quite well for me.

[kimmer]

I have this Tripplite USB 3 hub and it works quite well for me.

Thanks, but I’m looking for one that draws power from the electric plug in the wall, not from my iMac.

[Xairbusdriver]

This is the last one I've bought (Apr 4, 18). The new iMac only has 4 USB ports. I needed 6. This hub [has] 4 plus one to charge an iDevice. I only use 3 of the ports all the time, but there is a lightening cord in the last port that plugs into either the keyboard or the track pad when one of them needs a battery charge. The iDevice has another lightening cord connected to the Apple Watch charger, which I rarely wear (don't tell my son who bought it for me! ).