iMessage confustion...

[Dreambird]

Recently off and on for the last several months my MBP doesn't receive the iMessages my sister sends me. They used to show up on both my MBP AND my iPad but of late I've disabled it on the iPad if I don't need it or it won't show up on the MBP at all. I haven't been able to find anything online as those links always seem to be involving an iPhone. The only place anything but my MBP is involved here with iPad iMessage turned off is the iPhone my sister uses to message me. That one is like 400 miles away up in Grande Prairie so I don't see that it has anything to do with the reception on my MBP. Especially since it was working fine for a long time when she already had the same iPhone anyway.

I couldn't care less about iMessage for any other reason than it's a handy way for my sister and I to keep in touch so for that reason it matters to me that the MBP suddenly doesn't want to receive messages. The only thing I can do now and then is shut the machine right down and restart it... that will often make any messages that were hanging around in the ether show up. It's driving me a bit batty because I'm always missing messages until I either just think of rebooting the machine or a get an email from her telling me she's tried to message me. We're both stumped about this one. I COULD turn on iMessage on the iPad and use that but why should I when I have a nice big MBP keyboard it's just easier all the way 'round to use the MBP.

One thing I haven't tried just for argument's sake is putting the iPad at the other end of the house from my MBP. It's usually sitting on the same table but I have disabled iMessages on it so???

It's just stupid because it worked and now it doesn't. Everything is the same on the MBP... the iPad's been upgraded from 9.3.5 to 11.4.1 in case that had anything to do with it but iMessage is still turned off on the iPad so it's not like the the messages are showing up only there as they were for awhile.

Anyone have any ideas? From I see by searching the subject online there's always someone not getting messages from their iPhone on their MBP or something like that so it doesn't really apply to me unless something I don't know like that an iPhone used long distance to message me matters. 

[Xairbusdriver]

When things work and then don't, there is always a reason. Often when updating an OS9 or iOS) some settings you had made get changed. Since, as far as I know, Messages uses iCloud for syncing between iDevices and desktop Macs, I would check that all machines are logging into iCloud.

BTW, the name is now the same on all new OS's. There is no "iMessages" unless you are using an UN-updated OS. If you are using a device that cannot be updated, there could easily be a difference in how it syncs or cooperates with the updated OD.

The common items in this problem is iCloud and OS ages.

As far as I know, there is no difference between a cellular-capable iPad and an iPhone. If the iPad is not cellular-capable, then it obviously requires WiFi for syncing.

[Dreambird]

Well, I have suspected iCloud so that is a possibility. Just to point out though NEITHER my MBP or my iPad runs iCloud, disabled on both.

This afternoon I got a message from my sister with absolutely no problem... I even got the "ding" sound when it came in. So it is an intermittent problem for sure.

My messages get archived in my Home/Library/Messages
I don't believe they sync to the iPad... I've never looked for them and that part doesn't matter to me anyway since my sister and I generally chat when I'm on the MBP anyway.

And you are right... it isn't iMessages, it's just Messages... this is how well Apple has me trained! I'm using to everything being "iEverything!"  I wouldn't say my OS's are ancient... the MBP runs El Capitan and the iPad runs 11.4.1. I realize I'm probably looking at upping the MBP to High Sierra. I downloaded and stored the installer, unless I can see something to convince me to go straight to Mojave. Anyway I left myself that option. As for the iPad OS... not until I have to... right now with 11.4.1 I can still do everything via iTunes including syncing Apps as I am able to run the iTunes 12.6.4 they released for that purpose.

Unfortunately upgrades and such for the MBP are on hold for awhile because there are some things that fall under the heading of "life happens" and the risk of a messed up computer is not an option at the moment. Right now I've got as they say "the devil I know."

Just for the sake of trying it, I'm going to move the iPad a bit further away from MBP, instead of it sitting right next to it I can move it over to the speakers that it works with, I can charge it there and everything. It seems odd that messages do come in better on the MBP if the iPad has messages turned off and is not plugged into a USB port on the MBP. Worth a try if it's more consistent.

[Xairbusdriver]

NEITHER my MBP or my iPad runs iCloud

You don't "run" iCloud, you simply use it to sync data between apps and for a small amount of storage. I have no idea why you would "disable" it when you have apps like Messages, Mail, etc. that sync their data via iCloud. Of course, if you don't want to see your new mail or messages on any device you have, I guess that's fine.

My messages get archived in my Home/Library/Messages
I don't believe they sync to the iPad.

And they never will, with iCloud disabled. Nor will you be able to read a whole thread on both. If any messages are getting to the iPad, it may be due to having a WiFi sync enabled between the two devices.

[Dreambird]

OK it's used to sync... however you've hit the nail on the head... I don't really care whether all my messages show up on the iPad or not as I just never use the iPad to type between my sister and I when I'd sooner use the big keyboard on the MBP. It drives me bonkers that new messages come in on the iPad and not on the MBP. Far as I'm concerned I'd rather they came in only on the MBP and not the iPad.
But yes, when I check Messages on the iPad and signed in enabling it again there is a whole long thread of messages. They've been coming in there when sent by my sister until "I" disabled messages on the iPad trying to force them to come in on the MBP.

The really exasperating thing is that they did used to do that... they came in perfectly on my MBP and on the iPad. I'd hear the notification on the iPad maybe a minute after it hit the MBP. Past that I just used the MBP. I think the reason there is a whole laundry list of messages on the iPad is because that was never an issue... my sister sent it and it came in on the iPad AND the MBP. So why all of a sudden do I have actually shut the MBP and restart it to see if any messages came in? I don't see just "iCloud" as the issue since both machines have been fine working without it for a long time before. And actually I can read all my messages as a thread with the Messages app too... as long as I don't close the conversation. If I do that then it shows up only in the archive but it's still there and organized by date so I can still easily find a part that I want to see.

No secret... I have no use for iCloud whatsoever... all it does when the mood hits it is to mess up my iTunes library by deciding I should want to download whole albums of music from the stupid cloud when I have them set up to look in my library and silly me but those are the ones I want to use. So what to do... I have to go through my whole iTunes library in iTunes and deselect "Live Updating" for each one. So I turn on iCloud just to please Messages when I don't care about syncing them so long as they come in when sent on my MBP which is the only place I want to see them?

Oh and Mail... yes there's another one I don't really need iCloud for. The Mail app on the iPad is just as capable of fetching mail as the one on the MBP. On the odd occasion I've needed an email for something on the iPad I've always found it without iCloud. Both machines/devices whatever are capable of getting my mail down from my ISP on their own.

[Paddy]

Er...I think you've managed to mix a few things up here. The iTunes/iCloud issue is because of the way you've set (or not) your preferences in iTunes. It's not some mysterious built-in trouble-making on the part of Apple. I have an enormous iTunes library - I also have Apple Music. But I don't manage or do anything with it via iCloud; I have iCloud Music Library UNCHECKED in the preferences. I suspect that yours is/was checked.

See: https://support.apple.com/en-ca/HT204926 - scroll down to the Mac bit, though you may want to check what's going on with the iPad as well.

As for the Messages, they work flawlessly for me 95%* of the time and I use iCloud to sync - so I see them on my iPhone, iPad and Mac.

https://www.imore.com/how-set-messages-your-mac

As Jim noted, non-updated OS/iOS could be an issue as well - you don't say which versions you're running on the iPad and Mac.

*Very occasionally things don't show up on one device (either the Mac or the iPad - never the iPhone) for reasons I haven't quite figured out - but usually the missing messages show up eventually; I suspect it's a wifi/sync issue and it's not enough of a problem that I've bother trying to figure it out.

[Dreambird]

Hi Paddy,

My OS info etc is in my signature:
MacBook Pro Retina, mid-2012, SSD 500GB, 16GB RAM, OS 10.11.6, iPad Air 2, iOS 11.4.1

The one thing that is different from normal is my version of iTunes... I use v12.6.4 so I can sync apps etc. with iOS 11.4.1
I don't have the option to uncheck iCloud Music Library in my iTunes preferences. I do have under downloads in the preference to uncheck "Always Check For Available Downloads"

What I have done is gone through all my playlists and unchecked "Live Updating"
The type of thing that happens to me for example is like the latest incident recently. I did a sync of my iPad from the MBP and it informed me a particular song from Bruce Springsteen's album, Nebraska could not be synced because it could not be found. So I checked the playlist and indeed the mentioned song was not there but neither were any of the other songs from the album, not from the iTunes Music Library on my machine anyway. They all had the iCloud symbol... so I deleted the whole playlist and tried to set up another Smart Playlist using the appropriate info and it should have picked up the album from the library on my machine in the iTunes Music folder. It wouldn't and I couldn't find it in the store under purchased to redownload either. I thought I'd lost the album somehow except that it was there in my iTunes Music folder. I got it back by using the import function... to re-import it to my music library in iTunes. That was right out of the blue, no reason for that to happen but it did and it's happened before. I've now also set my iPad to show only music on "this device." This sort of thing has happened to me now and then even before the current OS I run on the MBP or iPad.

I will give the links you left a good reading... hopefully they'll shed some light on the matter... thank you! I could always go ahead and upgrade iTunes too and just get used to it... I prefer 12.6.4 but that's what it is... a preference. In every way it works perfectly with iOS 11.4.1 and I have no good reason to think it's that causing a problem... it happened already before I upgraded to this iOS and iTunes setup.

[Dreambird]

Regarding the preferences and not having the option of de-selecting the iCloud Music Library as I mentioned I do not have in my iTunes preferences under Downloads the option to uncheck "Always Check For Available Downloads", I believe I will do that because I noted that in the main menu of iTunes under "Accounts" one can check for available downloads manually so I'm not missing anything. I rarely have anything except the time or two I've bought a TV series season. The music where the iCloud version hasn't gotten exchanged for the one in my iTunes Music Library on my HD haven't for the vast part been improvements or anything like a higher bitrate or whatever. Mostly it's just a version that's no better than what I already had physically on my machine. So it's really just been a pain!

Oh... BTW... my sister and I just finished a very successful convo via Messages... I'll see if it sticks. All I've done is move the iPad across the room and plug it into the speakers for charging... who knows?

[Dreambird]

Hi Paddy,

Apparently according to the links you left for me explain why I don't have some of the options in my iTunes preferences that you do such as the option not to use the iCloud Music Library and such. It would be because I don't subscribe to Apple Music or iTunes Match... with a subscription you get the extra options. I do remember iTunes Match from quite some time ago... it always prompted me in iTunes to use it but I never did subscribe to that either. I was able to confirm that there are no subscriptions on my account for these things. I never used Genius either. However I can't absolutely remember with 100% certainty what I MIGHT have done in the past to encourage the iCloud shenanigans in my iTunes Music Library.

It must have been something I set way back as I know it's not likely to just happen out of the blue. In any case I've had iCloud showing up in my music for some time and now and then it replaces the music in a playlist that I have in my HD's iTunes Music Library. I would think that de-selecting "live updating" should stop that. I've already selected on my iPad to show only music "on this device." Which is whatever I sync over to it...