Author Topic: Wifi repeater  (Read 8213 times)

Offline hingyfan

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« on: February 28, 2011, 09:46:41 PM »
My wife's infatuation with the iPad has me again thinking of expanding wireless coverage in house. I put the Apple Extreme (saucer) back on line when my wife started using her long neglected 17" laptop for work (the price of success, something i personally not have to pay!). I also use wifi for connectivity with the iphones (ATT coverage is spotty here). Also i use the old iphone3 almost exclusively to tune in internet radio stations and it works great with the wifi.
Anyway, we have a sprawling house, all on one floor, except the the basement, which is not finished. There is an unfinished attic too.
There are two almost separate parts of the house, with a brick wall between them. The wifi stops at the wall. The table top iMac and router are in a back room. I need to get the wifi into the living room in the front so the ipad and laptop will work in there.
I would also like to use setup this to play itunes from the desktop in tha back room through the stereo the front room but i haven't thought that one through yet.
Running ethernet cables seems like too much of a chore. But i saw wifi repeaters in an magazine ad and thought that might work. Does anyone have experience with them? The seem inexpensive enough that i might get two if needed.
I also wouldnt now how to hook up a cable since the saucer has only one "out" and that is going righ to the desktop I do not want to go wireless on the iMac.
If it matters, this is pre-intel.
Thanks!
« Last Edit: March 01, 2011, 01:25:16 PM by hingyfan »

Offline Highmac

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« Reply #1 on: March 01, 2011, 12:26:26 AM »
The HornetTek Janus got a good write-up on TechRadar (MacFormat) so might be worth a look. Though it was let down by the reviewer having trouble finding instructions and the Mac driver  wallbash.gif
Neil
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Offline Paddy

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« Reply #2 on: March 01, 2011, 08:11:38 AM »
Well, I don't think I'd jump right on one that didn't work out of the box with Macs, Neil. wink.gif

This one might do the job...at 4X the price, I sure hope so...:

http://www.macwireless.com/html/products/a...1n_repeater.php
"If computers get too powerful, we can organize them into committees. That'll do them in." ~Author unknown •iMac 5K, 27" 3.6Ghz i9 (2019) • 16" M1 MBP(2021) • 9.7" iPad Pro • iPhone 13

Offline Xairbusdriver

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« Reply #3 on: March 01, 2011, 08:58:11 AM »
I have absolutely no experience with MacWireless (which is probably a division of another retail firm..."PC"Wireless?) but they have several solutions that might help, hingy. Specifically, check their "Antenna & Booster Chooser" page. Be aware that these are basically signal amplifiers and directional antennae and they are not necessarily cheap. However, a plain brick wall should not be impenetrable. Is the wall also covered with plaster which usually has an expanded metal 'lathe' for the plaster to 'stick' to?
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Offline hingyfan

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« Reply #4 on: March 01, 2011, 11:32:28 AM »
The wall is covered on the inside with a painted wood veneer. The other side of the wall is an outdoor alcove, with siding over it. then there is the desired living room. I'm going to try to draw a diagram! hold on.
OK here is the odd house. Note a bedroom, the master bedroom, opens on the kitchen.
It was originally a  bungalow and is now a sprawling estate! Not really but it is large and all one one floor, although there is an attic, a basement and a sub basement. The previous owner's father was a carpenter and the two of them went nuts on it. Our inspector almost fainted but here we are.
The drawing is primitive and doesn't show the alcoves and there should be a bathroom or two somewhere.
Also off the kitchen is a deck and i would like coverage there.
I'm now in the back room labeled Mac. The rooms on this side of the house work fine off the Extreme saucer. But there is a brick wall and distance between the computer room and the living room. I figure what I need is two repeaters. One under the living room and one between that and the computer, also in the basement.
My friend, who is something of an expert, says one or maybe two Airport Expresses should do it. These things were always a mystery to me. I thought they only carried itunes to remote stereos, which is actually part of what i want but not main thing.
Funny thing i like to tell about the house is that i was disinterested in the walk through until the agent said, this house is a bit strange, it has a sub basement. And she took us down there. This is under the big living room. It is huge. With visions of the band getting back together and rehearsing down there, i almost blurted out We'll take it!
But we did take and i did get a band together and we actually work, sometimes.
Turns out the owner was a gym teacher. He and his father put this in as a gym. Still has chin-up bars.
Actually  I don't have enough time or room to describe the whole thing. Did i mention the 120 foot driveway? Did i mention the three big snow storms we had this winter?
« Last Edit: March 01, 2011, 12:43:47 PM by hingyfan »

Offline Xairbusdriver

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« Reply #5 on: March 01, 2011, 03:22:39 PM »
No telling what might be behind the siding and the paneling... dntknw.gif

Since you have a basement (or two!) I'd really consider using Ethernet connections between the "Mac" room and anywhere else you might want to put a repeater. I don't think simply adding more Airport stations is the most efficient or least expensive method. Apple once made their Airport routers with external antenna connectors, but no longer. A good antenna is a good way to extend coverage, but only if the signal strong enough to use the full bandwidth, if the signal gets too weak, the hardware slows down because of constantly resending the same data.

I know nothing about trying to connect two Airport routers via Ethernet {nor many other things!}, but it might just work. I'll do some searching...

Tons of links here: <Sharing Apple Base Station Experiences>

This seems to confirm that an Ethernet connection would solve your distance and bandwidth problems quite inexpensively. <Apple Discussion Topic: two airports connected by ethernet, extending same wireless network>

Now, is that a cross-over cable or just straight through?! Thinking.gif You can get a 100 foot 'straight' for less than <$50 (+ shipping).
Your last option is color, perhaps you'd best check with your wife about that (even though the cable will be mostly out-of-sight! yes.gif
« Last Edit: March 01, 2011, 04:28:06 PM by Xairbusdriver »
THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF COUNTRIES
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And the United States = The Banana system
CAUTION! Childhood vaccinations cause adults! :yes:

Offline hingyfan

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« Reply #6 on: March 01, 2011, 07:41:43 PM »
My first concern is the Saucer has only one out line and that is connected to the desktop machine. I have no intention of making the iMac wireless because I can see performance drop when it is not hard wired. I dont think this line can be split, at least not without some other device.
My second concern is drilling more holes in walls and/or floors. A third concern is getting this to work together. I think i am reading the wireless ones, when they work, do everything automatically.
We do pay for an extra wifi speed "boost."
I think i'll try buying one Airport extreme and see what that does. At the very least it can eventually be used to connect the stereo in the other room.

Offline Xairbusdriver

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« Reply #7 on: March 01, 2011, 10:05:49 PM »
If you have electrical power in the basements under the rooms you want to have WiFi, you need not put any holes in those floors. You could have the entire WiFi network mounted in the basement. As for your wired connection, I'd put the 'holes' in the wall and cover that with nice cover plates maybe even with Ethernet connections. The 'hole' to the basement would be through the bottom plate of the wall down into the basement and connected to the Base Station. But you may want to put the older BS at the end of the Ethernet cable with any new station under the room with the Mac.

I agree that there is usually a big speed hit when using WiFi, even with the latest version (n?). And I use Ethernet to our BS, also. But remember that if you continue to use the old 'saucer' you will degrade the whole WiFi network to the fastest speed it has. And a wireless connection between each BS will also introduce additional latency which might make some tasks difficult or impossible. Ethernet will negate that problem.

Am I beginning to sound like a cable salesman! blush-anim-cl.gif rofl.gif

Keep in mind that the Apple Stations publish a pretty small transmitter power rating and it may even be overstated. If I were to spend money on more wireless equipment, I would definitely factor in a (transmitter) power booster/repeater rather than simply buying additional low powered base stations. The lower the power, the shorter the usable distance available between stations and the slower the bandwidth.
THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF COUNTRIES
Those that use metric = #1 Measurement system
And the United States = The Banana system
CAUTION! Childhood vaccinations cause adults! :yes:

Offline hingyfan

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« Reply #8 on: March 01, 2011, 10:13:19 PM »
My original question is about repeaters. That's what i want, i think.

Offline Paddy

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« Reply #9 on: March 01, 2011, 10:29:20 PM »
This might help:

http://www.ezlan.net/Distance.html

I'd suggest the first step would be to get a new Airport Extreme and see how that works - it might even be enough. I've found ours WAY better than the old Snow that we had.
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Offline RNKIII

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« Reply #10 on: March 01, 2011, 10:55:07 PM »
IAWP... We had an older 'snow igloo' style Airport base,which started to have problems.  We replaced it with an Express and have not had any problem with it.  It sets in the basement next to my iMac and the cable modem, and covers our whole house and a good distance into the backyard...  Good price also compared to the current Extreme or its 1-2 Tb storage counterpart.
I would give it a try for under $80, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

Bob K.   Rnkiii
Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day; teach him to
use the Net and he won't bother you for weeks.

Offline Highmac

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« Reply #11 on: March 02, 2011, 12:34:13 AM »
I keep reading that the wi-fi router should be as high as possible - could it be placed in that unfinished attic?

At least adds another possibility into your lengthening list wink.gif
Neil
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Offline pendragon

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« Reply #12 on: March 02, 2011, 07:44:40 AM »
Neil,

I think the 30 free trial of Bear Extender is worth a go, though I am uncertain re shipping machinations across then pond. Perhaps an email to the developer is the ticket.

FWIW, I found the Developer Interview worthwhile.
Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. ~ Voltaire

Offline Xairbusdriver

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« Reply #13 on: March 02, 2011, 11:44:47 AM »
The key factor in any improvement of signal coverage is the transmitter power and the efficiency (most brands are <25mW) of the antennae (Apple chooses to make them totally hidden and even inside metal housings, external and directional is much better, even with the same power levels). There are power boosters available that can provide a whole one watt, but there are regulatory limits that will keep you from legally doing much more than that.

Limited power is not necessarily a bad thing, limiting your WiFi to your house is safer than transmitting to the whole block! yes.gif

You already know...
    Ethernet is faster
    You need (at least) another base station
    You already have at least two ways to lay the wiring with only one (hidden) hole
What we don't know is how much this extra cost and expense is worth to get WiFi access in who knows how many more rooms.

Good luck, young Will Robinson! salute.gif wink.gif
THERE ARE TWO TYPES OF COUNTRIES
Those that use metric = #1 Measurement system
And the United States = The Banana system
CAUTION! Childhood vaccinations cause adults! :yes:

Offline Highmac

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« Reply #14 on: March 03, 2011, 01:01:35 AM »
Hi Pendragon - I was just adding some info for hingyfan's query.

Touch wood, the only wifi trouble at present is the old Netgear DG834G which seems to need reboots more frequently! I have two Airport Expresses for playing iTunes through the kitchen and living-room stereos and they both get the Netgear signal fine (simultaneously), each about 40 feet away and through two 4½in brick walls.

The Bear Extender looks useful, but I can't find a stockist so it would have to be imported to the UK personally; and the 30-day free trial doesn't include shipping and return costs.... sad.gif
Neil
MacMini (2018) OS10.14.6 (Mojave). Monitor: LG 27in 4K Ultra HD LED.
15in MacBook Pro (Mid 2014) OS10.13.4 (High Sierra);
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